Labor needs “a good explanation” to change NBN, says Morrow

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news The chief executive of the NBN company has made an extraordinary intervention into the pre-election national political debate over the National Broadband Network, warning Labor that it would need “a good explanation” to change the NBN model imposed by the Coalition.

The NBN was initiated as a project by Labor Prime Minister Kevin Rudd and continued during the Rudd and Gillard administrations for four and a half years. However, when the Coalition took power in September 2013, it radically overhauled the NBN model, mandating the use of technically inferior Fibre to the Node and HFC cable infrastructure as part of the rollout.

Speculation currently abounds that both the Government and the Opposition are planning to announce new NBN policies during the period ahead of this year’s Federal Election. It is considered likely that both will maintain the HFC cable aspect of the NBN, but will shift the FIbre to the Node aspect to a technically superior Fibre to the Distribution Point model, which will allow significantly higher speeds to NBN customers.

However, in an article published by The Australian this week, NBN chief executive Bill Morrow explicitly attacked the Opposition for any proposal it might have to change the NBN’s model once again. Delimiter recommends readers click here for the full article.

The executive pointed out the Fibre to the Node model for the NBN was well-advanced, and it would cost “not billions, but a lot of money” to change the model.

“It would be material,” he added. “Now would they do that? I don’t know. But they would need a good explanation if they did.”

Under Labor, the NBN company’s founding team led by chief executive Mike Quigley had repeatedly backed Labor’s technically superior Fibre to the Premises model as being the best approach for Australia in the long term.

However, the current management of the NBN company — appointed during Malcolm Turnbull’s time as as Communications Minister — has repeatedly defended the Coalition’s Multi-Technology Mix model for the NBN, reversing the company’s public stance on its model.

Under both Coalition and Labor Governments, the NBN company has developed a history of intervening during Federal Election campaigns.

For example, during the 2010 Federal Election campaign, then-NBN company CEO Mike Quigley revealed in a major speech that Labor’s model for the NBN was capable of gigabit speeds, in a move that was criticised by some as potentially breaching the Caretaker Conventions which constrain the behaviour of government companies such as the NBN company during an election period.

The NBN company also held frequent launch events during the 2013 Federal Election campaign, at which Labor’s original NBN policy was highlighted.

Similarly, the NBN company has already begun explicitly assisting the current Coalition Government with election events.

In one example, in late-March the NBN company joined Telstra at an election event held by Environment Minister Greg Hunt in his electorate of Flinders. The NBN company also assisted with an election campaign event in Woy Woy in NSW, attended by local Liberal MP Lucy Wicks and Prime Minister Malcolm Turnbull.

In another move, the NBN company included a quote from Nationals MP John Cobb in a media release in March announcing the official start of construction on nearly 18,000 premises in the area of Orange. Cobb is the Member for Calare, which includes a number of regional NSW centres, including Orange.

opinion/analysis
I don’t think it’s a huge stretch to guess that Labor will not be retaining a number of current NBN senior executives (possibly including Morrow, although I’m not sure about that), if it wins the upcoming Federal Election.

Not only do several have close personal links to Turnbull or the Liberal Party, but the tone of the company’s public communications has been quite hostile to Labor’s preferred FTTP model for some time.

If Morrow wants to keep his job in a Labor administration, I would caution him not to continue to make these kinds of statements in future — they are inappropriate comments to make towards a party which may shortly be in Government. It is up for the Government of the day to set policy and the NBN company to implement it — not the other way around.

Image credit: NBN company

221 COMMENTS

  1. Seriously?

    He could receive a “condensed” 5000 page document explaining exactly why or of course, the actual large version.

    • Seriously. Since 1975 I’m sure there have been some major policy retrenchments from both sides, but the one that sticks in my mind is Labor’s massive gift to the Nation after Malfunction Fraser privatised labor’s MediBank. On 12 March 1983 Bob Hawke summarily resurrected public healthcare, calling it MediCare, and promised LibCo that every time they privatised it, it would return on the first day of a new Labor Administration. No LibCo Government has cared to test the promise since.

      I have no doubt John Howard had this in mind on 11 March 1996, with Compulsory Super.

      But there’s a huge difference between resurrecting National Public Healthcare and resurrecting NBN. It’s the cost. So much money has been ploughed into the MTM that over-building it can only be described as a complete waste of taxpayer dollars. However, it does make sense to Not Continue new contracts, to replace Not In Ground contracts with FTTP, then as cost and time permit all copper MTM can be slowly overbuilt. But those on MTM should not hold their breath. This will be a long time coming, as FTTP must first be so established that no incoming LibCo administration will dare roll it back, just like the National Public HealthCare.

      One may also wish that Telstra will be taken to the cleaners\\\\\\\courts to recover costs owed to the Nation. But given Labor’s studious inaction on this front, I hold little hope.

      • Gordon you know NBN trying to lock in most NBN contracts for FTTN by sept. So if we don’t have a dd I don’t think much labor can do.

        • Yah. It looks like that’s what NBN did pre-LibCo. (Yayyyy!!!!) It does seem Labor will be behind the 8-ball on this one.

          • So Gordon all those people that where in the 3 year rollout plan for FTTP when the Libs took over got there FTTP?

          • not to mention Tasmania where TurnCoat actually had the contracts changed despite seeming to promise Taswegian’s they’d get FTTP!

          • @Jason K – With a “vested interest” I was really only watching Victoria Park and South Perth, can’t say for other areas started at the same time. But yes, all of our area (6VIC, 6SPT, 6APP) got FTTP.

            @Derek O – Da. 2X will pay for that I think, defecating in the nest you want to take over is always a bad move.

          • Well when the lib took over 3.5 million where mark for FTTP over the next 3 years and they only just hit 2 million now.

          • @Jason K Not all areas. Mine had FTTP construction due to start in November 2013 (2 months after the election, for those playing at home) but it was scratched and we now have a FTTN build underway.

      • Gordon, if we don’t get the nbn back on track delivering long term national infrastructure for the public good (the whole point of gov), the costs of not doing so to our economy will be extreme.

        Businesses are already struggling to work with the garbage we have now, I know this from personal experience in the Telco industry.

        • “… the costs of not doing so to our economy will be extreme.”

          +1.

          @R0ninX3ph – try not shooting the messengers. It’s bad for business.

        • @R0ninX3ph As bad as their arguments can be, if ours are strong it’s always a good idea to meet them head-on.

    • There is a really good explanation “79% of customers on Labor’s FTTP network willingly chose to connect at 25Mbps or slower.” This makes the 16% of customers on 100Mbps connections lower than:
      – private schooling (34.8% of all students; ABS 4221.0 – Schools, Australia 2015)
      – private healthcare (56% of Australians)

      If we compare it on income and wealth using ABS 6523.0 – Household Income and Wealth, Australia 2013-14, then top 20% of households owned 62% of total household wealth and received 40% of total income.

      Based on these comparisons, it is reasonable to expect that anyone wanting more than 25Mbps should expect to pay for the privilege. I haven’t heard Labor acknowledge that speed tiers on the NBN has created a digital divide which makes it difficult to see that they would justify FTTP based on equality.

      • Only half the story, CVC pricing, and to a lesser extent, international backhaul pricing is making higher speed tiers for home irrelevant as contention ratios are too high, and thus you never receive the speed you pay for.

      • Mathew
        Considering 85% on FTTN are connection to 25Mbps or less and only 7% to 100Mbps it must be an even failure than FTTP.

        • But is that because that’s all the FTTN connections are capable of. Why pay for higher connection if the copper cant handle it or peak congestion slows it down anyway

      • Mathew – what totally ignorant comment – if only it were that simple, but the major factor you are missing is price.

        under the NBN terrible CVC prices, delivering 12-25Mbps is actually MORE expensive than ADSL. what the point of building this thing to protect Telstra pricing model? this should have been revolutionary and disruptive – like every other fibre network in the world. speed tiers make NO sense, there no real cost difference between providing the end user with 12Mbps or 100Mbps.

        A typical family with a reasonable ADSL speed (due to location) spending $50-60 per month on internet, has no option but to opt for the slow tiers.

        There is a reason i dont fly first class.. but its not because im happy with the seat in economy….

        • I don’t think I’m missing price. Price is the main reason 79% have ordered 25Mbps or slower on fibre. Price is the reason Labor predicted that only 70% of premises would connect to the NBN.

          > A typical family with a reasonable ADSL speed (due to location) spending $50-60 per month on internet, has no option but to opt for the slow tiers.

          Labor’s financial model expects that the wholesale ARPU must rise to > $100/month to meet the budget.

          > There is a reason i dont fly first class.. but its not because im happy with the seat in economy

          In economy you arrive at the same destination at the same time time as the first class passenger although you leave the plane last. On a road when driving a clunker you arrive at the same destination at the same time as someone driving a Tesla.

          In Labor’s NBN world, you have to sit in the slow lane and watch people only paying only six times as much ($24/12Mbps versus $150/1Gbps) travelling almost 100 times faster. Imagine sitting on a freeway in the slow lane limited to 2km/h while the cars a couple of lanes over are travelling at 200km/h.

          • Yet your no teirs FTTN plan.

            You want some people get given a rusted out combi bearly making 25km. Then pay more if they need to go faster.

            You want some people get given a rusted out Corolla going alittle bits faster. Then pay even more if they need to go faster.

            Then you have people get given a Holden or ford with no need to pay more as they already go 100km or faster.

            Then you have people get given a gold plated Ferrari with no need to pay more ever.

          • What was it? 15% on 12/1? So, you can spin it the opposite and say that 85% of customers are choosing plans of 25Mbps or higher.

            Wow, sounds a hell of a lot more impressive than when you try to make it sound negative.

            AKA, more people opting to pay MORE than they originally expected, thus increasing the revenue.

            What about the fact that the LNP is expect 30% of customers on 100Mbit in 2020? No? No comment on that?

          • Yeah anyone can comment on that, one is a prediction, as in a prediction that may or may not happen, the other is what is actually happening.

            As per normal FTTN bashers always live in a fantasy of hope of what might happen.

          • Well devoid currently
            FTTP has 15.7% on 100Mbps
            FTTB has 14% on 100Mbps
            FTTN has 7% on 100Mbps

          • “Yeah anyone can comment on that, one is a prediction, as in a prediction that may or may not happen, the other is what is actually happening.”

            Completely ignoring the rest of my comment I see, picking out small parts to reply to.

            So, why now is the big deal about 79% on 25Mbit or lower, when it used to be 50% on 12Mbit? That was only a predicition of what might happen. And it didn’t happen, we are now in a world where more people are paying for higher plans than Labor ever predicted, thus making more revenue than they had originally planned for.

            “Well devoid currently
            FTTP has 15.7% on 100Mbps
            FTTB has 14% on 100Mbps
            FTTN has 7% on 100Mbps”

            It TOTALLY because people don’t want 100Mbit… and not at all because those on FTTN are unable to get it….. *eye roll*

          • @ alain.

            “Yeah anyone can comment on that, one is a prediction, as in a prediction that may or may not happen.”

            Tell that to Mathew, who specialises in arguing over predictions such as 50%/12mbps (bzzzt) and has done so multiple times daily for about 5 years.

            Yet you never had a go at him once did you? Curious.

            His new 2010 prediction to grab and argue over is 1%/1Gpbs. Which he parades out daily now…

            Wanna have a go at him, or laugh with us now?

            Speaking of laughing…

            Add your insistence on posting articles as your smoking gun, which were written in 2013 (ROFL) and we have the daily double of der (another DDD) right here.

            Such is the desperation and lack of facts you blinded MTM cheer girlies have…

            You’re welcome

          • > So, why now is the big deal about 79% on 25Mbit or lower, when it used to be 50% on 12Mbit?

            Because what it indicates is that speed tiers are creating a digital divide in Australia and that this is likely to grow increasingly wider in the future.

            79% on 25Mbps and lower is significant because it means that 4 in 5 Australians are willingly choosing the speeds that are easily available on HFC, FTTN, FTTB & FTTP. By default this sets a benchmark for an acceptable service level, which makes it reasonable that people wanting faster speeds should not expected government assistance.

            You have two reasonable positions:
            1. Agree that 25Mbps is an acceptable speed
            2. Disagree that 25Mbps is an acceptable speed
            The technology used to deliver it is irrelevant as long as it is capable.

          • @Rizz
            > Tell that to Mathew, who specialises in arguing over predictions such as 50%/12mbps (bzzzt) and has done so multiple times daily for about 5 years.

            So Labor didn’t foresee that Telstra wouldn’t offer a 12Mbps plan, however 12Mbps + 25Mbps is significantly higher than Labor predicted and 100Mbps is significantly lower (and falling) which validates my point that Labor’s NBN has created and is entrenching a digital divide in Australia that is wider than other socio-economic divides.

            > His new 2010 prediction to grab and argue over is 1%/1Gpbs. Which he parades out daily now

            It is not new. I’ve been pointing out this number since Quigley announced it in the leadup to the 2010 election as a face saving measure when Google fibre was announced. The reason I quote it is to remind you that Labor’s NBN was more about spin than reality. Currently we have zero RSPs selling plans faster than 100Mbps, which should give you ample reason to question how Labor could get it so wrong!

            If you find the cost of FoD too expensive, then it is highly unlikely you are in the 1% who are able to afford 1Gbps.

          • Lol Mathew

            Speed teir are not creating the digital divide. The price is FTTN was going to be cheaper but not it cost the same as FTTP.

            With FTTP everyone has the same choice is speed FTTN you don’t you might only be able access 25Mbps maybe even 50Mbps if you lucky or so far the lucky 7% on 100Mbps ATM as FTTN customers won’t have a choice will they.

            So can you predict in 4 years time what the main speeds is Mathew. Will it be 25Mbps ( mostly as that’s all the NBN is now required to do), will it be 50Mbps as Turnbull has claimed 90% will be able to get it or will it be 100Mbps. If it’s 50 or 100 your argument is invalid but considering only 7% on FTTN is only picking 100Mbps only half as much as FTTP or FTTB.

            So MTM figures are even worst than labor FTTP by your own logic FTTP is the better choice and not creating a digital divide.

          • Blah, blah, blah Mathew…

            More of the same recycled crud…

            79% are on 25mbps or less…

            Well in case you missed it, I used your figures at another thread yesterday, to disccover that 88% are on 25mbps or over…

            BFD eh? Yes we cab all do a Mathew if we choose to, it’s just that we (apart from making a point as I did) know it’s idiocy to do so.

            So please, enough with the cherry picked BS, swearing estimations to be gospel to argue (yes argue not rationally correspond) and get a new hobby…

            Because like MTM, you have failed for over 5 years in this one..

            You’re welcome.

          • Again, this argument about xx% on xx/xx is one of the most stupid ones going. Those numbers are absolutely irrelevant!
            When ADSL first became available in Australia, more than 80% of the population stayed on dialup…2 years later those numbers reversed almost overnight.
            So do you think the Telcos decided that people didn’t want anything much faster so no ADSL2+ for you! Of course not…that also would have been a stupid argument.
            Demand in Australia will increase dramatically just as it is all over the world (we aren’t that special)…

            As demand increases for speed, servers will increase in capability to deliver speed, which will increase demand, which will increase supply, etc, etc, etc…

            Let the Emus keep their head in the sand, you should not…

          • @Rizz
            > So please, enough with the cherry picked BS, swearing estimations to be gospel to argue (yes argue not rationally correspond) and get a new hobby…

            Except that the real world number are worse than what I’ve been repeatedly told were Labor’s conservative estimates.

            @chas
            > Again, this argument about xx% on xx/xx is one of the most stupid ones going. Those numbers are absolutely irrelevant!

            The numbers are incredibly relevant because it describes how FTTP is being experienced in the real world.

            A real world example: Under Labor’s initial roll out plan, my parents were due to receive FTTP in 2014, but nothing yet. Their ADSL connection is a rock solid 16Mbps. As they are retired money is tight so they will choose the cheapest plan, meaning that the speed of their connection will drop by 25%.

            > When ADSL first became available in Australia, more than 80% of the population stayed on dialup…2 years later those numbers reversed almost overnight.

            Hardly surprising when switching to ADSL meant that people could drop their second phone line for the dialup modem and have an always on connection. The speed jump was also a factor of 10. For the 79% connecting on fibre at 25Mbps or slower, the switch from ASDL to FTT? or HFC doesn’t deliver much benefit for many when you consider the average ADSL2+ speed is 11.5Mbps.

            My parents only moved from ADSL 512/128Kbps to uncapped ADSL2+ because it was cheaper. Speed was less important although they did enjoy the faster speeds.

            If Labor had made FTTP a game changer for everyone instead of just the small minority connecting at 100Mbps and faster then your argument would have merit.

          • @Matt – “The numbers are incredibly relevant because it describes how FTTP is being experienced in the real world”

            No, it really doesn’t. It describes a blip in time that has no statistical or real value at all…
            As I pointed out, it took 2 YEARS for folks to move to ADSL from dialup…and as we know now, that delay had no significance whatsoever.
            And as you pointed out, that even included being able to cut their line rental costs in half!
            Change is always slow to start, but in this case it will gather momentum quite rapidly (as it has in the rest of the world).

          • @Mathew

            Except that the real world number are worse than Coalition conservative estimates.

            ” Under Labor’s initial roll out plan, my parents were due to receive FTTP in 2014, but nothing yet.”
            I didn’t know labor was still rolling out FTTP in 2014 oh wait not theory where not.

            So if in 4 years time 50Mbps or even 100Mbps ( which is won’t on a network only required to deliver an up to 25Mbps) you would be proven wrong?

          • “Except that the real world number are worse than what I’ve been repeatedly told were Labor’s conservative estimates.”

            So there is absolutely no link in the drop of 100Mbit/50Mbit services ordered and the rollout of FTTN…. None at all? Every single one of those customers on FTTN is definitely 100% able to get 100Mbit on their connection, and is willingly choosing to have 25Mbit instead? Why would anyone pay for a 100Mbit connection if they only get 60Mbit? Why would anyone pay for a 50Mbit connection if they only get 35Mbit? Why would anyone pay for a 25Mbit connection if they only get 15Mbit?

            If you believe that, then you’re as much a fool as Reality.

          • Indeed, while he sobs his 5 year daily bombardment of one estimation 50/12, is affected by Telstra not offering 12mbps… he refuses to accept your scenario, at the other end?

            Q. Are these guys all the same, in their one eyed crusade?
            A. Yes.

            Ooh and 88% are on 25mbps or over too, d’oh…lol

          • Ronin,

            Why would anyone pay for a 100Mbit connection if they only get 60Mbit?

            So all residences that are on 12/1 or 25/5 either FTTN or FTTP are disgruntled 100/40 users who tried it couldn’t get the speed and then changed to lower speed plans?

            You argument is irrational, customers decide up front what speed they want based on price, speed and quota, it’s not a case of they cannot get the 100/40 speed so why bother because they don’t actually know that until they try it.

            The reason is because they never wanted it in the first place.

          • Wrong again devoid
            As with FTTP you will get 100Mbps if you decide to pay for it.

            FTTN you don’t have a choice on what max speed you will get. Could be just UP TO 25Mbps as that is want the current MTM is only required to deliver.

          • “So all residences that are on 12/1 or 25/5 either FTTN or FTTP are disgruntled 100/40 users who tried it couldn’t get the speed and then changed to lower speed plans?”

            Of course not, I didn’t mean to imply that, but the fact the 100Mbit customer numbers is dropping doesn’t automatically mean those customers are CHOOSING 25Mbit, they might have taken 100Mbit and discovered they do not get close to that.

            My point was, that framing the conversation one way or the other is completely disingenuous and is only working to fulfil your own prophecies.

            Unless there is testing on lines before customers order a service, and the line speeds published, or if you go and survey all customers and why they have chosen specific speeds, we will never know the true causes of customers dropping to lower speeds.

            So to claim that the reason they have those speeds is because “they are happy with them” is equally ridiculous.

            I am happy to admit that it is very likely the majority aren’t choosing that speed becasue they cannot attain higher, but you cannot claim there isn’t a percentage of technically minded people who are willing to pay for 100Mbit for their first month to determine their line speed and adjust their plan accordingly.

            My parents area is going live in August, and I have told my father to do just that. Order 100Mbit initially, and run speed tests multiple times over that month to find their average speed, and drop down if it isn’t greater than a 75Mbit average.

            Your assumption that people don’t or can’t do this, is actually incredibly rude and assumes that only those who have technical knowledge can. Speedtest.net is available for anyone to use.

          • Yes got all that Ronin and Rizz, my conclusion remains.

            The reason is because they never wanted it in the first place!

          • Right, so why are we wasting up to $56Bn on a network to provide speeds nobody wants?

            Especially since we only need 15Mbit per household by 2023? Why are we even building a network that provides even 25Mbit? We should build the nodes every 1.5Km and just put ADSL2+ hardware in them, and provide that 15Mbit by 2023, why put in 4x the nodes to provide “up to” 100Mbit, why spruik speed advances in copper technology like G.Fast and XG.Fast. DOCSIS 3.0 and 3.1 on HFC. Why spruik those 8Gbps “possible” speeds in lab tests, when all we need is 15Mbit in 7 years time?

            Feel free to pick a single line out of my post and reply to that instead of addressing the meat of the argument.

          • @alternate – “The reason is because they never wanted it in the first place!”

            I see…so God has spoken to you and you are relaying the message of the Prophet?

            As stated…who cares? Speed demand is highly transitory and we have a long history of moving to the fastest speed available in this country. It doesn’t matter if it takes a year or 2, it always, always, always happens…

          • @ alain

            “The reason is because they never wanted it in the first place!”

            Oh that’s GOLD. Even for you…

            This is your recycled argument from 5 years ago, wait for it, against…

            *** HFC… it was FAILED HFC *** according to you, wasn’t it? And why ? because according to you “no one wanted HFC”. In fact you said you had it hanging across the road from you and it was only good for the pigeons to perch upon… didn’t you? Man up and admit your own words, even only once, it won’t hurt (we laugh at you anyway :)

            Anyhoo, 5 years later it’s lucrative HFC now according to you… OMFG

            But seeing this, there’s hope for you yet, circa 2021 when your super duper politicians on the right become “fibre zealots”, you can laud FTTP as lucrative too..

            Nice work… FFS

            You’re welcome

        • Big problem with the $50 or $60 comparison, is (in my example for instance) I am paying $30 to telstra for my phone line.

          If I went Naked DSL, I would be paying $10 to Telstra for my phone line (so $60 to $70 for internet).

          People often look at “internet prices” on the NBN in a vacuum. When I migrate to the NBN I will be spending $80 per month. The same as my current $50 per month internet access. I can get a significantly better connection with that knowledge.

      • You’re also missing the fact that modern networks having the ability via SDN to provide higher level connection speeds “on demand” driven by application or dynamic needs.
        Want to do a UHD video con with a specialist doctor so he can view high resolution video images? Easy to do under a fibre model, impossible with FTTN. You could book in a session with a doctor, the SDN platform could provision either a separate VC or temporarily speed boost for the session, then tear it down. The cost could be allocated to the end user or the service provider.
        Want to increase speed for an hour long hololense video conference? Again, easily done under a model where the base infrastructure can support scalable speeds. Click a button, get 100mbit uploads for the hour and be charged $5 for it. Or for an immersive 3D VR conference?
        People need to move their thinking past the basics of core internet access and start thinking about what a dynamic application driven network is capable of providing. Copper based networks with shitty upload speeds will always be a poor cousin in providing dynamic access compared to their Fibre alternatives.

      • Mathew,
        10 yrs ago, people connected at 1.5Mbps. Now most want 25Mbps. In 10 yrs from now, people may want faster. MTM is just not able to deliver in an economical manner.
        nbn have had to resort to quoting misleading statistics, such as the average of the peak sync speeds achieved in 24 hrs, calling this the average FTTN speed. Deceptive at best, but closer to a misleading lie.
        Bit like saying the average speed on the M1 is 125kps. Someone achieves this at least every 24 hrs.

        • > 10 yrs ago, people connected at 1.5Mbps. Now most want 25Mbps. In 10 yrs from now, people may want faster.

          I’m not sure you can say most people want 25Mbps. If Telstra started offering 12Mbps you might find that the most popular plan is 12Mbps (currently 33% versus 46% for 25Mbps).

          > MTM is just not able to deliver in an economical manner.

          MTM will deliver this in a user pays manner which is fair if you are asking more than the community standard.

          • How will MTM deliver when it’s following FTTP model. FTTN avc price was going to be just $16 but it’s the same price as FTTP.

          • Obviously if our No1 RSP doesn’t offer it, that should tell a story in itself Mathew, no?

            Oh sorry how insensitive of me, still sobbing about the last 5 years of complete incorrectness re: arguing over a fucking 50/12 estimation, are we?

            Well you were warned years ago and have had plenty of time to prepare for the inevitable conclusion of W R O N G, everyone else (even the naysayers, I’d guess) could see.

            You’re welcome

          • Yet when 12Mb plans did rise with the copper switch off, you were more than happy to take all those people moved over to default 12Mb until they could specify what they wanted into you OCD 50% on 12Mb BS. Really Mathew, give it a rest, and seriously get some help over this obsession, it cannot be healthy.

          • Matt – “you might find that the most popular plan is 12Mbps (currently 33% versus 46% for 25Mbps)”

            According to Telstra, that is 20% phone-only (no internet), 13% 12Mbps, and 46% 25Mbps…100Mbps is more popular than 12Mbps…

            “MTM will deliver this in a user pays manner”
            How is it “user-pays” when it is based on your distance from the node? Also, what if your wrong and people actually want to have internet that is as fast as the rest of the world? With MTM, that is not possible to do for at least another decade or 2…

      • Once you have installed sufficient capacity, there is no technical difficulty or difference in cost between the different speed tiers. No reason for different speed tiers, and the main reason for allowing sufficient speed for everyone, especially rural, is that it allows for high resolution video, which can reduce needs for travel to face to face meetings.

      • “There is a really good explanation”
        “it is reasonable to expect that anyone wanting more than 25Mbps should expect to pay for the privilege”
        And yet what is actually happening is that near-all of Australia is being condemned to pay twice as much for the network WHILE being LIMITED to 25Mbps speeds on average. That is, under MTM, 79% of NBN customers are paying twice as much as they would have under the FTTP plan. So what was your ‘explanation’ again? Because the tripe you posted didn’t make a lick of sense.

  2. I’ve got a pretty good explanation for him why they would change the model:

    They would be the Government in power and it is their right to do that with a GBE and their policy.

    Imagine if Quigley had brought this bullshit up before the last election? The Ozztrayan would have had a field day with it with blessings from Uncle Rupert.

    • HAH! Thank u so much!

      It galls me how much rubbish Morrison has been allowed to get away w/ in broad daylight (ie. snubbing Senate Enquiries, “commercial in confidence”, a new definition of “transparency”, and so forth) and not one goddamned article on the front pages about it.

      Meanwhile we had freaking articles insinuating Quigly as corrupt (ie. the olde pac bell scandals) up to articles on him “wasting money on coffee”. Christ the fact he even went out of his way to even include such trivial costings like that and he was being shown as “hiding information”

      It astounds me how much sway media has been given by the people

      • Like you mentioned, the media has a big play in this. If it favors one party like it currently does it will spew propaganda against the other. Labor is no angel, but we have media bias, and political favors and corruption etc., so I’ve been under the assumption that our democracy is broken. If facts were put on news papers no doubt FTTP will be seen as THE superior technology of the future. Quigly is a very good CEO of the NBN, sad to see his (and the previous NBN staffs’) efforts torn down.

        20 years from now we’ll be talking about that “world changing application” some nation with superior telecoms developed that had benefited from multi gigabit ‘symmetrical’ internet, and we’ll be going “crikey mate that could’ve been us! Yea well our shitty internet bled off all promising Aussie entrepreneurs ’cause they can’t afford business grade internet” :P (or something similar)

      • Indeed its not like we saw the breakdown of the recent NBN excursion to the USA by MTM members … the one in which they seemingly came back saying the opposite of what the US folk were too lol!

    • They could start by telling NBN Co that they can’t begin rolling out FTTN to any new areas without permission from the communications minister. Then they can order them to produce a “strategic review”, which includes a costing of upgrading FTTN to FTTP after the rollout has been completed vs the cost of changing to a FTTP rollout (not to mention a whole bunch of assumptions which will guarantee that the FTTP rollout will be cheaper than the upgrade).

      Oh, and also fire all the board members.

      And when they publish the report, make sure to redact anything that could possibly make FTTN look good in any way. Then talk about FTTN like it’s a contagious cancer that will kill everyone if it’s allowed to spread (conveniently ignoring any benefits, perceived or otherwise).

  3. “an extraordinary intervention” simply isn’t strong enough. It’s bloody astounding.
    He forgets that he is just the CEO of a GBE. It is NOT his role to comment on matters in the political arena in the lead up to an election.
    Not only is it outside his remit, it also displays a degree of political partisanship which is completely unacceptable. And the end result is that it destroys his credibility in the performance of his role.

    As for keeping his job under a Labor Govt, I would suggest he has already signed his own dismissal notice.
    (And I can’t help thinking he would be glad to get out of the Turnbull MTM NBN mess as soon as possible. Preferably before the full extent of the stuff up became known.)

    • +1

      A good explanation?

      As if Morrow needed to ask. The past 3 years is explanation enough.

    • I agree, but the more we chop and change technologies, we’re just asking for more issues. FttN/DP would work for the vast majority of houses.

      It’s not the most ideal solution, but would be a good compromise.

      I am still curious about how people with substantial links to the LNP could be awarded roles within such an organisation, and the LNP not be pinged with corruption/nepotism is still beyond me.

      • “FttN/DP would work for the vast majority of houses”

        FTTdp, yes it might…it has enough headroom to last for another decade and is far easier to convert to FTTP at the end of that time.
        FTTN however has none of this, and unless you believe that the good folks of Australia are done with their need for data and will not require anything more than slightly better ADSL2 for the next 10 years or more, then it is a crazy direction to take and is anything but a compromise.

      • The chopping changing thing, we already suffered the biggest hit with the change to FTTN, with the renegotiating of Telstra’s copper (buying it) and the backend infrastructure to support FTTN.

        At this point, changing back to FTTH would be as simple as signing contracts that stipulate the use of FTTH. I would imagine that current FTTN contracts will be left to run to completion, with new contracts signed for FTTH.

        • Yes it would be simple except Labor are not doing it.

          1. It costs more, estimated to be $74B-$84B of peak funding.
          2. It will extend the NBN completion date yet again, estimated to be 2026-2028.

          Other than those two ‘minor’ problems it’s all go go go, just like it was at the end of 2013, well that’s if you call a 50% cut to the original rollout estimates go go go.

          • How is it currently estimated to be 2026-28?

            I thought the MTM NBN was on time and on budget of 29 billion and providing a minimum of 25 megabits to every australian by the end of 2016?

          • Labor are not in government you fool. The Coalition didn’t do it until after they got in. Typical double standards Reality.

          • Rizz,

            What do you call a 75% cut in the coalition original rollout estimates

            Something you made up?

          • Lol devoid is going mad still waiting on the pre election policy to say other wise devoid where is that link again

            Let’s see fully complete this year now only 2.5M to be complete this year. Well it more than 75% if you must lol

          • Rizz,

            Who said it was going to be fully complete this year, the estimate was always going to be 2020.

            BTW you are starting to break up and hard to understand, which is the stunt you deliberately pull everytime when the questions get awkward to answer rationally.

          • Lol devoid fails in spectacular fashion

            Page 2
            Our goal is for every household and business to have access to broadband with a download data rate of between 25 and 100 megabits per second by late 2016.

            Page 6
            our aim is that everyone in the nation should have access to broadband with download data rates of between 25 and 100 megabits per second by 2016

            Page 8
            a revised objective will be set: download data rates of between 25 and 100 megabits per second for the whole nation by 2016.

            Page 8 again
            We will issue a revised statement of expectations directing nBn Co to provide broadband services with a minimum download data rate of 25 megabits per second by the end of 2016 in all areas of australia

            http://lpaweb-static.s3.amazonaws.com/Policies/NBN.pdf

          • “25 megs” to all by 2016!!!

            any other Lib lie’s you’d like us to expose Devoid?

          • All since revised and well publicised in the media, just like the Labor NBN Co had multiple revisions from their original CP in three years.

            Their 2007 NBN policy was real revision, from FTTN before the election to FTTP after the election.

            What is hilarious (unless they kill it completely) is they will be back to endorsing FTTN in 2016.

          • Wow triple back flip from devoid

            Now it’s revised instead of me making it up lol. But as you claimed labor did 50% while the coalition did more than 75% which is worst lol.

          • So since your triple back flip devoid you can stop asking for what labor is going to do go an election policy because they can revised it.

          • LOL alain,

            You, Mitch (the Hof’s) ventriloquists dummy, is desperately having to revert to being the dickpuppet again?

            And try to excuse the MTM fuckup with acceptable revisions that when the last plan was being rolled out were completely unacceptable (even when much less than now)…

            ROFLMFAO at the hypocrisy

            Are things that bad? Apparently…

            We always know when you’re struggling, you either contradict previous comments (this is very common – been doing it for years), or call a poster someone else (just started a few months ago), or say detour signs/moved goalposts (again another mainstay).

            But when soundly smacked (so 99% of the time) you simply disappear.

            PRICELESS free to air entertainment, right there.

            I wonder, if Rupert and the Coalition know their dollars are being spent on shills that keep us all entertained so much, that we don’t need Fox.

            The irony eh?

            You’re welcome

          • @ alternate – “estimated to be $74B-$84B of peak funding”, by “2026-2028”

            An “estimate” done by folks with a huge agenda to avoid it. Considering that it is several times higher than established and proven figures from around the world, I would put zero faith in it.
            The same is true for the completion date. It’s a Joe Hockey type estimate…

          • ‘The World’ is doing funding estimates for Australia’s FTTP rollout, really?

            lol

          • @alternate – in a way, yes…can you think of a reason that it would cost more than 5 times as much to roll out FTTP here as it does in the US? Or almost twice as much here as in NZ?

            I know you try to blind yourself to everything in the world except your favourite political press releases, but that does not mean the rest of the world doesn’t really exist.

          • Chas, you see, when it comes to FTTP, no other country is like Australia at all. Australia is unique when it comes to rolling out FTTP.

            However, when it comes to rolling out FTTN, Australia isn’t unique, and New Zealand (oh wait they’re now doing FTTP….) uhm… the UK! (wait.. nope… they’re also now doing FTTP)…. uhm…. any other country doing FTTN is a perfect example of why Australia should do FTTN!

          • And yet NZ FTTP price is almost the same as FTTN go figure.

            Or that Australia FTTN rollout is even slower than its FTTP rollout go figure

          • Go figure that the NZ FTTP rollout is to 75% of the population of Melbourne, of the approx area of Victoria.

            Go figure that a major percentage of the Chorus rollout is using the cheaper fibre aerial deployment.

            Go figure that just like here NZ is upgrading its HFC network.

            On the other side of the Tasman, Vodafone New Zealand is sweetening the pot in the super-fast broadband roll-out by announcing a multi-million dollar upgrade to its HFC network which will see it deliver 1Gbps (retail) service DOCSIS 3.1 in mid-2016.

            Back to the FTTP rollout.

            The UFB rollout has made steady progress since then with services passing some 815,000 premises across the country at end-September. However, only 133,000 subscribers have so far signed up for the service – representing take-up of 16 per cent

            http://www.nbnco.com.au/blog/industry/docsis-3-1-gathering-pace-kiwis-jump-on-board-too.html

            oh dear.

          • Oh no devoid going mad again

            Devoid getting confused between. Peak funding and CPP lol

            FTTP still cheaper lol

            Vodafone tried to sell the HFC to chorus and failed lol. But now it looks the the LNP pre election policy allowing the HFC to complete against there failed FTTN not buy it upgrade it at the cost to the taxpayer lol

          • I am pretty sure they used worst case scenario estimations for FTTP and best case scenarios for FTTN. That’s why cost blew out UP TO 56 billion. No mention of possible symmetrical guaranteed speeds. All you get is currently UP TO 25 Mbps, just like ADSL now we have UP TO 20 Mbps.
            I don’t get why you don’t just do FTTdp or FTTP. Near zero maintenance cost, fiber cable lasts decades, no degradation for 40km+, not affected by water, electromagnetic interference, scalable for many years (NG-PON2 etc) all you do is change the electronics at both ends. And symmetrical speeds !

            Copper network
            56 billion for up to 25/50/100mbps. Can it scale after 100mbps? Not to mention the upload speeds. Can it do zero ping around Australia ? Can you get a guaranteed speed tier 24/7 ? How much to pay to power node ? How much to maintain legacy copper ? Will maintenance costs increase due to legacy network ?

            Fiber network
            74-84 billion for GUARANTEED 25/50/100mbps. Possible symmetrical upload speeds. Near zero maintenance. Scalable into symmetrical gigabit (think 50 years from now when we really need these kinds of speeds). Zero ping around Australia (think medical inspections through the internet). Requires zero power (passive network only need to power electronics at both ends). Not affected by water, electromagnetic interference.

            Tell me, UP TO 56 billion for a copper network, and when the world turbo’s away and leaves us in the dust with their FTTP networks, and we start upgrading “again” to play the catch up game, how much will that cost ?

            UP TO 56 billion + (how much to remove FTTN and HFC and replace with FTTdp or FTTP) billion.
            Let’s say fibre backhaul for FTTN is not enough to do a proper FTTP/FTTdp, so you end up having to run fiber all the way from the POI again?

            And no DOCSIS 3.1 is not even a proper standard yet. Also an extra 600 million on top of buying it for 800 million to fix Optus’ HFC network ? HAHAHAHA. 11 billion to buy broken plastic cover copper from telstra with ongoing payments to them for maintenance and ducts ? HAHAHAHA. Come let us be known as the joke of the world for buying back used and broken things that we sold off last time !! :D

            current network : UP TO 56 billion + estimated 74-84 billion = very expensive, waste of time, money and materials.

            Age of innovation boom relying on degraded copper and 0.5mbps upload speeds to communicate with peers and share massive blueprints for potentially successful startups who can’t afford business grade internet. I love it !!!!!!

            No matter how you spin it, copper network is dead. We all know it. Its not about ALP or LNP, its about the future of Australia’s telecoms. we will upgrade to FTTP eventually and it will cost much much more. Just a matter of time. And MTM proponents like you will be drowned out by the needs of Australians for a superior network. Don’t worry to join the rest of us when we get a superior network, pay up to replace the last mile copper :D

          • @alternate – “the NZ FTTP rollout is to 75% of the population of Melbourne”

            Which makes not a jot of difference since we are talking about CPP, not total cost.

            “NZ is upgrading its HFC network” Yup…until they get their FTTP finished. What they are NOT doing is buying 2 very used and poor HFC systems for a vast amount of money, then refurbishing them by installing new nodes and expanding the rollout areas…

          • The NBN Co is not buying two HFC networks, they are chucked in with the Optus and Telstra NBN deal that Conroy and Labor signed off on.

            Even taking a worst case hypothetical scenario that 25% is unsuitable and needs to replaced with new HFC or FTTN you are still ahead.

  4. amounts to arrogant bullying to defend Telstra shareholders and their money laundering scheme to Telstra.

  5. Bill Morrow, you can f’off back to the USA, we arent interested in your LibTard POV!!!

    • USA is too good for Morrow. He can fuck off to the copper age because that’s about the only place he wants Australia to be.

  6. Bill Morrow king of clowns comes up with some amazing stuff.

    The only explanation Labor needs is “fuck you Bill” and as someone concerned with progress and communications infrastructure in Australia I’d support them telling you where to go.

    The only explanation we got from coalition clowns for irrationally going backwards instead of continuing the correct FttP roll out as planed was “cheepa, fasta, soonerer” at least if Labor do change anything (which let’s face it since you and the rest of your zoo crew chums made a mess of it and MTM was designed to be a politically motivated destructive policy from the start it will be difficult) we already understand the rationale behind it.

    • I do hope that the “fuck you Bill” includes Bill Shorten.
      He isn’t a person who inspires confidence.

      • However Shorten appears to have far better policies, so that “lack of inspiration” you feel may be a bit shortsighted in this case.

        • Agreed, as much as I am wary of Bill S, under his leadership they’ve been coming out with some really top notch well thought thru policies so far.

          All Turnbull has managed so far is to fuck over the nbn and produce a massive pile of quickly euthanized thought bubbles.

          • Labor Party political speech brought to you by Derek O, a completely neutral unbiased amateur commentator with no agenda.

            lol

          • So Reality, he should lie? Or your rose coloured glasses make it seem like something other than what he has described has been happening?

          • Devoid, fuck off, you contribute nothing but lies and Lib propaganda, you are a complete oxygen thief!

            I also think the greens have some good policies too and have said so around here but you will ignore anything that doesnt fit into your IPA supplied POV.

          • @ Reality, of cause you have No agenda Reality, in that case we will call you a-genderless.

      • @Ryan “He isn’t a person who inspires confidence.”

        Look at the last PM (abbot) we had that inspired people …
        Look at the current PM that ‘inspires’ people.

        Right now I’ll happily take a bland and boring Shorty if it means this country gets some decent legislation through for a change!

        This isn’t after all Australia’s got talent ;)!

  7. I want an explanation as to why Morrow as a CEO of a GBE is allowed to be blatantly political..?

  8. If Shorten and ALP win in the upcoming election even before the acceptance speach, he should be asking the AFP to stop him from flying back to the Usa to ask him a few questions.

  9. The ‘good excuse’ for changing to the MTM was that it would cost half as much as it will, and be finished by the end of this year.

  10. Also, the blue book from NBN this time would probably be the most forthcoming document they’ve produced since Sep 2013, so it would be interesting to see if Labor publishes it (assuming they win the election).

  11. Morrow is the one who needs “a good explanation” about why he should keep his job.

  12. A good explanation would be welcome. However, all thats actually needed is to win the election. After all that what happened in 2013 when FTTP got shredded.

  13. Seriously, Morrow has proven he is just Turnbull’s butt-monkey.

    If Labor get elected, the first thing they should do is get a warrant issued for Morrow’s arrest.
    He should be charged with treason for sabotaging Australia’s communications infrastructure.

    • Abbott and Turnbull should also be charged with treason for willfully destroying Australia’s largest ever and most important infrastructure project!

        • Oh dear, I think the DO train has jumped the rails, again!

          Just a reminder that the 2013 election result sealed the fate of the Labor FTTP, the Labor NBN Co pathetic rollout end result helped its demise also and an alternative NBN policy was overwhelming voted in.

          • Welcome to alain’s daily, ridiculous contradiction corner…

            We’ll have to start calling his endless flow of dumb contradictions…

            “AGAIN ALAIN AGAIN”… to dumb it down ti his fav 3 word slogan.

            Anyhoo… alain has argued previously many times that broadband is of absolutely no significance to voters/elections and even argues over one word from an internal report from his own “more precious than life itself conservatives” that suggested they could have won at least one seat more in Tas in 2010 (the hung parliament election – d’oh) had FTTP broadband not been a factor for people to vote against the Coalition.

            Now he says –

            “…an alternative NBN policy was overwhelming voted in.”

            And that boys and girls is more stunningly warped, illogical hypocrisy from the king of warped, illogical, hypocrisy.

            You’re welcome alain.

  14. I don’t think that Morrow is being condescending towards Labor, I see it him telling them that they need to start selling their version of the NBN a lot better, provide details and use facts and figures. Nothing wrong with that.

    He’s even giving them a hint that it would cost less than a billion to do so!

    At their moment, their policy is nothing more than “We will keep the Multi Technology Mix, change the Mix a little bit, and call it a “Hybrid” instead”. To be honest, this is a pathetic Labor policy and nothing like the previous NBN Policy that won over our hearts and minds.

    I wish Labor had the balls to put out decent policy. If I was shadow communications minister I would be saying “Well our original NBN Policy was superior, but the Liberal MTM policy has pushed the project in a different direction that has been a waste of time and money. They have already sunk a lot of money into it, so we will try to salvage what we can if it is economical to do so, but our focus will be FTTdp which is very similar to our FTTP plan and will have a clear, inexpensive pathway to upgrade that to full FTTP, unlike the Liberal MTM Policy, HFC and FTTN.”. I would then be a happy man.

    • Maybe they will when an election has been announced but considering the Medias attention span he’ll be lucky to get a full sentence reported and even then they will paraphrase it.

    • Simon,

      If I was shadow communications minister I would be saying “Well our original NBN Policy was superior,

      Well I don’t think Clare would agree with you that it was.

      Shadow Communications Minister Jason Clare has admitted the national broadband network’s rollout was “too slow” under Labor and criticised the Coalition for not improving it.

      http://www.afr.com/news/politics/national/coalition-should-have-improved-labors-nbn-clare-20140609-iwo59

      That’s a classic so he admits it was slow, but wants the Coalition to fix it, well they did they dropped FTTP and the rollout deployment speed has increased, FTTN is currently averaging 8,000 premises a week.

      but the Liberal MTM policy has pushed the project in a different direction that has been a waste of time and money.

      So obtaining the HFC and copper infrastructure for the same price Labor were going to pay to have it shut it down and overbuild with expensive brownfields FTTP is a waste of time of money?

      but our focus will be FTTdp which is very similar to our FTTP plan

      No it won’t, there is no way FTTdp will be targeted for 93% of residences to be finished by 2021, so if Labor use it in any way it will nothing like their old FTTP plan.

      The Labor NBN plan may have some FTTdp in the MtM mix, the Coalition plan may have some FTTdp in their MtM mix, other than that the Labor NBN pre election plan 2016 will be amazingly different.

      lol

      • LOL yourself.

        Being too slow, does not mean it was not superior. It is in fact Superior in almost every way. Technically, Financially, and if the current delays are to be believed, it will also take longer to do…

        So maybe not so slow.

        “So obtaining the HFC and copper infrastructure for the same price Labor were going to pay to have it shut it down and overbuild with expensive brownfields FTTP is a waste of time of money?”
        Yes, very much so.
        HFC is a stop gap to moving to FTTP. We don’t even have a proper working solution for it either. And now we own it, so we now have to maintain it. yay. Oh and Decommission it eventually.

        “No it won’t, there is no way FTTdp will be targeted for 93% of residences to be finished by 2021, so if Labor use it in any way it will nothing like their old FTTP plan.”

        You like us, have no idea what it will be.
        You unlike us are so trapped in your believe anything the coalition do as the best thing ever, that you can’t see that FTTN won’t be able to make 2021 either.

      • “So obtaining the HFC and copper infrastructure for the same price Labor were going to pay to have it shut it down and overbuild with expensive brownfields FTTP is a waste of time of money?”

        Yes.

        Failed (your word) HFC is costly to maintain (well it is FAILED isn’t it, so YOU said), costly to upgrade (oh look another $1.6B is needed now) and is still inferior to FTTP. ALL COSTS OVER AND ABOVE THE IMAGINARY SAME PRICE YOU KEEP HARPING ON ABOUT. But shhh don’t mention any of that though. Sorry did I just SHOUT, I wonder why, when this little dishonesty game of your’s has been discredited for what it is, umpteen times.

        FTTN is FRAUDBAND according to the Coalition isn’t it?

        So let’s replace obsolete copper with… more fucking obsolete copper… ah the ideologically illogical eh?

        Even NBN™ improved some FRAUDBAND by replacing it with FTTB (making that an election promise broken, according to your logic applied to the others) and now there’s talk of another election promise being broken and introducing FttDp… oooh wah.

        Don’t forget the PM and NBN CEO both clearly say FTTP is the end goal too…

        Of course you’ll agree with every broken election promise and adopt them as your own… which is a clear admission that FTTN is not good enough.

        Embarrassing for you, a retrograde FTTN supporter.

        You’re welcome

      • wants the Coalition to fix it, well they did they dropped FTTP and the rollout deployment speed has increased, FTTN is currently averaging 8,000 premises a week.

        At what cost? You never mention the annual upkeep of FTTN. 29,000 actual vs 94,000 projected is not good progress by anyone’s standards. You also continue to ignore the benefit of FTTP completely (no upkeep in most cases, for starters, to give you a hand).

        • At what cost? You never mention the annual upkeep of FTTN.

          Neither did you.

          29,000 actual vs 94,000 projected is not good progress by anyone’s standards.

          It’s not 29,000 actual it’s 120,000 actual, so don’t lose any sleep about it.

          You also continue to ignore the benefit of FTTP completely (no upkeep in most cases, for starters, to give you a hand).

          FTTP is fine for greenfields, it’s a expensive over the top option for brownfield at $4,400 CPP, especially if you use it to overbuild existing BB fixed line infrastructure, and them shut down those infrastructures to help cost justify the ROI why you built FTTP in the first place!

          Labor will have realised this when announcing their 2016 NBN policy.

          • The 120,000 includes FTTB. The waters are muddied forever.

            $4400 CPP has been debunked by recent media reports and ignores documented rollout efficiencies.

          • The 120,000 includes FTTB.

            Yes I know it does, the problem is what exactly, would you prefer that FTTB stats are not reported at all because you and other MtM bashers don’t want to see any mention of MTM success stories?

            $4400 CPP has been debunked by recent media reports

            It has, so what is the correct Australian 2016 brownfields CPP figure?

            and ignores documented rollout efficiencies.

            Not sure what documentation you are referring to?

          • Well devoid you don’t want to use the correct for just FTTN rollout. But NZ getting it cost down to $2900 this year not far off the $2300 FTTN price

          • The waters are muddied forever.

            That muddy water corroded the copper.

            Sorry to break it too you devoid they are not rolling out FTTN

            Indeed. NZ quickly figured out it was garbage. Coalition clowns with dial-up speed brains will take longer.

          • @ alternate – “what is the correct Australian 2016 brownfields CPP figure?”
            Since most of the critical numbers are now redacted by NBNCo, that is not possible to tell. However, we can compare and contrast with other rollouts around the world…
            NZ is down to $2300 cpp
            The US is down to $800 cpp
            You somehow think it’s reasonable that it costs more than 5 times as much in Australia for a rollout than it does in the US?
            That’s just pure gullibility…

          • Well devoid we don’t know.

            We know they can already cut $600 off the price. But your hero Turnbull claimed the FTTP price would never change even though every where else has been able too. But you ignore.

          • @alternate – “I asked for the correct Australian FTTP figure”

            Knowing that the Coalition would not possibly allow the data to become public. All that shows is that Turnbull really does have something to hide in those figures…thanks for that.

            “USA private telcos’s like a Verizon rollout FTTP to their own customers in areas they pick in the USA”

            How does that reduce their rollout cost by over 80%?

            Are you trying to confuse revenue with CPP?

            “The NZ rollout I have referred to elsewhere in this discussion”

            And you confused total cost with CPP there as well…
            not good…

    • @Simon
      “I don’t think that Morrow is being condescending towards Labor, I see it him telling them that they need to start selling their version of the NBN a lot better, provide details and use facts and figures. Nothing wrong with that.”

      If the MTM actually realeased information anything like NBN did or actually answered Labor senator questions maybe Labor would have a better idea of what they can expect.

      Its a bit like schrodinger’s cat in the box conundrum currently, Labor will only really find out when they open it and they have to be in government for that too happen (because its likely Morrow and LNP have already peaked inside!).

  15. I can’t wait to see Morrow gets his ass handed down like a fly!
    Just wait you simple-minded moron! we will get our revenge for destroying FTTP!

  16. How about Morrow provide “a good explanation” as to why his much much much faster and cheaper internet has not been delivered to my door by 2016, as promised.

    What an incompetent CEO, he couldn’t even organize a pisson in a brewery, let alone meet any of his KPI’s. But he holds other people to his account.

  17. Given that the incumbent government is likely to change policy over time will Morrow be insisting that it too offer a “good explanation”.

    Surely if it’s appropriate for Morrow to question proposed policy it should apply to all political arms.

  18. As far as i am aware we are renting not owning the copper.

    However i wonder will we own the NEW copper that is being replaced or will it be owned by Telstra?

    This seems to something that has not been answered,

    SHOULD the Labor government (we can all hope but yeah the Mainstream media….) get in then i would expect Morrow to either Resign or be asked why he should be kept on, I would like to see Simon Hacket moved from Unofficial Director to CEO as he is one of the few Australians with REAL world experience in the running, operating, financing, etc of a Telecommunications Company and also pointed to cost savings for the NBN which they begrudgingly are sort of doing in some areas.

  19. Is it Edwardian?
    Or does Sergeant Morrow have fantasies that he is a cop on the beat? Maybe he’s been watching too many reruns of Chips: son, you better have a damn good explanation for this…

    In any case what an absolute goose.

  20. warning Labor that it would need “a good explanation” to change the NBN model imposed by the Coalition.

    Well that’s just common sense, if Labor are going to change the NBN model they need to explain why they are changing the NBN model, the electors first of all are owed an explanation why change is for the better.

    So far Labor have flagged they are not going to change much at all, after the 2007-2013 NBN debacle you can understand why.

    • Well devoid the coalition lied about there change.
      What was it again $29B 2016 target. Claiming FTTP would by $90B still hasn’t come close to that target with there reviews.

        • So devoid can you link me in there pre election policy where is said the MTM would cost $56B and be complete by 2020.

          Oh wait you can’t so go running away and cry

          • They’re just revisions Jason!

            Just like how they never jumped up and down ranting and raving when the NBN targets were revised under Labor…. oh…. wait…..

    • As I said above, no, they don’t.

      They don’t need to prove anything, they don’t need to have any good explanation as to why they change anything. If they win power, they have ultimate control over the NBN, that is their good explanation.

      Whether Morrow likes it or not, he doesn’t get to dictate to the Government what the NBN should be, the Government dictates to the GBE what they should be building. Exactly like what happened in 2013 when the Liberals won power, their “good explanation” was it would cost $29Bn, provide 25Mbit to all by 2016, and it was ready to roll on day 1 after the election.

      So, their good explanation was a lie, Labor can do exactly the same thing. He needs to turn off his political allegiances and just do his fucking job that he is being paid $1m more a year than Quigley to do.

      • He is, he’s rolling out the Coalition MtM, the same model as the Labor NBN Co will, but they will shove ‘we will look at FTTdp later’ in the Labor policy text somewhere .

          • Want a bet? there is no way Labor will make any pre election commitment to any substantial FTTdp rollout that will replace outstanding FTTN build areas post election without reviewing the consequences of that commitment in relation to extra funding and what it will do to the overall NBN finish date.

          • Of course there will be those consequences. There’s the matter of the current rollout down like a lead balloon politically. Politically, they have to change it. Poor polling made worse by the current rollout = very bad.

          • Lol devoid maybe Turnbull should have done that. Instead we have gone from $29B to up to $70B

    • Actually Shane that is much deeper and crammed with facts than a lot of MtM bashing comment here.

      :)

      • Just because you do not understand the issues being presented by others, doesn’t mean they aren’t filled with facts.

        :)

          • No as I mentioned above alain, we don’t need pay TV for entartaiment we have you as our free to air comedy channel.

            Thank you for the laughs and memories, Krusty.

            You’re welcome

          • I already admitted I was wrong, why do you keep bringing it up?

            Piss off you wanker.

            We bring up your contradictions because you never admit them, I happily admitted it the second you pointed out I was wrong. So go shove it up your arse Reality.

          • I do find it ironic though, that literally the only thing you can pull out of your bag of tricks to use against me, is the one time I made a mistake regarding Foxtels retail offerings and that I didn’t know they had a full IPTV version of their service already.

            Which I admitted the moment you called me out for it, even though when you called me out on it, you acted like a complete and utter douchenozzle, I still admitted I was wrong and didn’t know about it.

            So, basically, you’re acting like a petulant child.

          • I’d suggest if alain had a big jar full of the current government farts, he would be claiming it the most wonderful fart jar ever…

            Until of course the lid comes off and the most putrid stench emits…

            Then that would of course be the stench left over from the last government…

            Sounds just like MTM… !

      • Let the punishment fit the crime.

        The MTM is the crime. So the bashing is the punishment,

        Because its a total fraud.

        • Makes hard who to vote for then based on a ‘different’ NBN policy eh?

          Perhaps you can persuade the Motoring Enthusiasts Party to fully endorse and resurrect FTTP to 93% by 2021.

          • Health policies yes…

            Is it true the Coalition’s health policy is…

            Hospitals are only for the well to do, our kinda people… because after all how the fuck are the poor gonna get to a hospital, when they don’t drive cars?

            Just having fun dearest alain, at your expense…I don’t really hate the Libs, as you clearly hate Labor, i just disagree with many of their current policies and their deceit pre the 2013 election.

            But at least the worst PM in history, Tones, is gone eh :)

            So if Mal was able to be Mal and not Tony’s fill in and introduce new blood into the Libs by getting rid of those crusty, 1950’s dinosaurs, who believe the age of entitlement is their’s and theirs only and was able to push his own actual beliefs, he may be all right.

            But that’s not possible with this latest batch of far right lunatic Abbott throwbacks dictating. Lunatics who would go even further to the right if they could… but of course they are a little scared that if they did so, they would fall off the edge of the earth.

      • Shane very kindly and thoughtfully tried to dumb it down, especially for you alain. But alas still too many confusing words eh?

        So how about this – “MTM is fucked”?

        One of those cosy, Tonesy, slogans, just for you…

        You’re welcome.

  21. Title needs to read
    Labor needs “a good explanation” to keep Bill Morrow on if they win the election

  22. “a good explanation” to change NBN

    How about “this one is a fucking joke and we don’t want to put the Australian people through this unmitigated disaster”

  23. This is a very funny statement for a CEO to suggest to his potential future Shareholders and bankers. I would suggest that Mr Morrow has his head in the sand when it comes to the nature of his organisation and from whom he takes his direction (his Board plus Shareholding Ministers).

  24. (Labor needs “a good explanation” to change NBN, says Morrow) No they don’t all they need to do is win government and if your not happy with that, well get another job.

  25. That was rude and extraordinary from Morrow, but there is a good explanation: Fibre to the Node is a dud and really, really should not be continued. I’ll always remember the words of the then chief technology officer of British Telecom: “Fibre to the [node] cabinet is one of the biggest mistakes humanity has made. It ties a knot in the cable in terms of bandwidth and imposes huge unreliability risks.” Yet the NBN is being modelled on BT’s rollout. And a year sooner for Australia, 2020 vs 2021, is not a time saving. I argue that a bit of extra time is absolutely necessary.

    The false economy is obvious – the annual upkeep of FTTN is never mentioned. The other options only cost marginally more when you factor in the inevitable efficiencies that develop during the build. With New Zealand’s FTTP down to $2900 per premises, it’s getting easier.

    • it would cost “not billions, but a lot of money” to change the model.

      “Not billions” is only marginally more compared to the total expenditure. This is undeniable.

  26. Would laugh if Quigley was put back in as head of NBNco and it went back to full FTTH plans, then they sold off that HFC and Copper BS to what ever chinese group of investors wanted it.
    What better way to stick it to the libs Hahaha.

  27. Quite simply this Mr Morrison i am a NBN customer on a 25/ 5 connection since December 2015 its now April 2016 and the connection has been shit for 4 months and the most telcos can deliver under current arrangements on fibre to the node is 25/5 MBPS its been revealed by many of the tleco companies other wise the service falls over due to mixed copper to exchange and copper to the home.

    The most they can get out of the current set up is 50mbps to some premises and that still requires a specially designed modem not currently offered to end users because of the Turnbull round out,

    Wireless is useless due to other communication interferences from surrounding users on different services to police communication devices interrupting the wireless networks.

    to get 100/ 100mbps you need the whole service to be fibre to the home wall installation right back to the telcos service exchanges as well as complete back boning which you can not get with current setup.

    Satellite technology for australia is useless as foxtel has shown many times as soon a storm hits you loose everything and same on my commercial TV and radios stations.

    But those hard wired unless their is water in the boxes or someone cuts the line you get the correct speeds, bandwidth, and packet delivery 96% of the time.

    Mr Scott Morrison you also missed the point no body actually trust the Liberals to deliver any technology benefits on the cheap they have a history of cost cutting and this lead to problems 3 to 4 years later which everyone knows when labour gets back into office has to spend up big to fix to fix the problem of cost cutting and this leads to other issue like shronky business owners cashing in like the pink batts saga that lead to deaths.

    Mr Morrison you would be better if you ditch the liberal attitudes and told us your real opinion on how to fix the NBN mess and the real estimated cost to deliver the full fibre to home wall installation and how to properly fix Liberals and labours ideas on the NBN rollout with full backboning the service to allow future upgrades and possible full satellite technology that over come environment issues.

    Scott Morrison your expertise does not stop with costing the NBN i have read your back ground and its time to tell Australia the real NBN rollout situation no political stance how much, can it deliver and what technology should have been used in the first place considering where we stand in the rest of the world.

    Cause at the end of the day it is end users who hook up are paying for this current dub NBN system lets hear the truth Mr Morrison can we have the real vision of how to improve the NBN from the telcos and your NBN company can we see the real reason for mix technology on a NBN and will it eventfully deliver 100/100 service that is fibre to wall installation in homes.

  28. because faulty copper is bad for productivity and the economy which the Liberals are seeking to kill.

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