news Communications Minister Mitch Fifield has praised the controversial Fibre to the Node technology which the NBN company is launching at the moment as part of the Coalition’s Multi-Technology Mix vision, describing FTTN as “superfast”, despite the fact that some residents may only get speeds of 50Mbps.
Yesterday Senator Fifield and Liberal Member for Dobell, Karen McNamara, visited Telstra’s Gorokan Exchange to mark the official launch of Telstra’s retail broadband plans over the NBN FTTN network. Other retailers such as iiNet have also begun selling services.
In a statement, Fifield said the NBN company would make FTTN services available to more than 20,000 homes and businesses on the NSW Central Coast over the next four weeks. More than 8,200 homes and businesses in Gorokan and Belmont are now able to order a service on the NBN FTTN network, according to Fifield.
The Minister’s statement said: “Tens of thousands of homes and businesses will be able to connect to superfast speeds of greater than 50 megabits per second before Christmas.”
“This is great news for the Central Coast, and proof of this Government’s delivery to our region,” said McNamara in Fifield’s statement.
By using the existing copper infrastructure running into homes, the NBN company can quickly build out the network, Fifield said, saving on construction costs and reducing the time residents must wait for broadband upgrades.
“The first commercial FTTN services were connected at Belmont in New South Wales last month and already many users are enjoying superfast broadband and a simple connection process,” the Minister’s statement said.
“Under the Coalition Government’s broadband policy, NBN has shaved years off construction time while still delivering superfast broadband to more than nine million premises nationwide over the next three years. The Central Coast and Hunter regions are the first to gain access to the FTTN-based network.”
The FTTN services will deliver maximum wholesale speeds to retail services providers of up to 100Mbps (download) and up to 40Mbps (upload).
opinion/analysis
At the moment it’s not clear precisely what speeds Australians can expect from the Fibre to the Node network the NBN company is building.
When the network launched in September, the NBN company said about 60 percent of premises to be covered by the network were within 400m from the current Telstra distribution pillar. This means that they can expect speeds close to the 100Mbps theoretical maximum. However, it’s less clear what speeds the rest of Australia will be getting … if you are beyond 700m, you can probably expect speeds closer to the minimum of 50Mbps.
Is 50Mbps still classed as “superfast” broadband? I am sure many Australians would be more than happy to be getting such speeds in 2015. However, I’m less sure that such speeds will still be sufficient as we push into the 2020’s, and especially as we get beyond 2025. At that point you’d have to argue that Australia is still going to be locked in a digital divide if these copper loops are not eventually upgraded.
Image credit: Office of Mitch Fifield
Renai some actually consider 12/1mbps “high-speed” so following that logic it doesn’t surprise me that someone just as technologically illiterate like Fifield would consider 50mbps “superfast”, they see the numbers, cant comprehend what it actually means in the real world so speeds like this actually impress them.
It probably really impresses residences that are using it, and were waiting waiting for the Labor FTTP dream of 93% of residences by 2021.
You know, the rollout that Conroy himself said was “too ambitious” and had a “failed construction model”.
Reality we are waiting for FTTN to be done by the end of 2016 you know in a years time not 7 years down the track.
Impressive that we’ll be waiting until 2021 for 25mbps speeds that was promised to us in 2016 due to coalition clown incompetence all with a $56 billion price tag.
How did you calculate that we will waiting until 2021 for 25 Mbps speeds, and correction it’s a maybe up to $56 billion price tag, first two figures a guess, second figure also a guess.
That’s easy to do, I guess it won’t be any of those guesses, and I guess that a Labor FTTP rollout would not have reached 93% of residences by 2021 if allowed to continue.
Funny that this article is about FttN (the future according to coalition clowns) but you keep brining up the past (FttP) we’ll never know what could have happened because the coalition got GimpCo to make a mess of it rather than proceed with the vastly superior plan. The only thing we can do is speculate. However since the fraudband patchwork plan is the one currently being executed we can make few predictions (just as the coalition clowns did about FttP). Since they’ve lied to us so far we have to take that into account so 2021 sounds more reasonable.
In the future if you insist on addressing me please consider the article topic else you will be met with a “your comment is invalid” URL.
Thanks for stopping by!
Well the NBN wont be finished by 2020 its 2022 since the CP16
“The Operating Plan addresses the period FY15-FY22 only, Management and the Board have not taken a view on assumptions beyond that time, and no better estimates exist than the assumptions applied in the Strategic Review dated December 2013.”
So if you would like me to quote the SR review that you said is an old document the SR S2 is only $8B more and complete a year later. But then thats the same doc you dismissed when the only real saving is $1B in taxpayer money.
But the CP16 said “no better estimates exist than the assumptions applied in the Strategic Review.”
So Jason K what we can gather from the above correspondences.
I.e. Reality’s comment (FttP by 2021) and your’s (MTM by 2022) is… that obviously you have both come to the conclusion that FttP would have been faster to roll out.
;)
Err but “Reality” what about those tens or hundreds of thousands (or more) in areas like mine who were programmed to have had (but no contracts locked in – well it’s been over 2 years of MTM stagnation) and already would have had FttP (yes, yes, even with the initial hold-ups)?
We are actual proof FttN is NOT faster and all this talk of waiting until 2021 is umm, just more mindless BS.
BTW – on the flip side we (here in a blue ribbon Liberal seat) are meant to receive FttN “within the first quarter of 2016”. Yeah that’s right… like when well pretty much EVERYBODY in Australia were supposed to, remember…LOL.
So don’t forget… I’ll keep you and the rest of the always faithful posted, as to whether it occurs or not.
K?
Pfft easily pleased with fraudband.
Dave let him have his moment, he just looks so proud standing next to that fraudband node.
The Minister’s statement said: “Tens of thousands of homes and businesses will be able to connect to superfast speeds of greater than 50 megabits per second before Christmas.”
Superfast! Does that mean that ALL homes and businesses, no matter the distance from the node, will see 50mbit+?
Obviously the closer you are, the better the speed… but in reality, VDSL after 500m starts slowing down pretty quickly. I’d say there’s a good chance after 500m, you’ll get 30-40mbit on average, on old phone lines. Maybe on some fresh copper with good jointing practices you’d do better.
The policy is 90% of premises to get minimum of 50mbps and 100% to get a minimum of 25.
Too bad if you’re unlucky enough to be in the 10%….that’s as good as it’s going to get.
During co-existence (while exchange based services such as ADSL are operating), NBN will only ‘guarantee’ 12/1.
I would be happy with 25 mbps, higher is a bonus, it’s superfast compared to what I get now on ADSL2+.
Well I’ve had 110/2.5 Mbps HFC at my previous house and the 12/1 Mbps ADSL2 I get now is proving extremely limiting.
Reality the sad reality is that through lack of investment in Australia and a national average of just 6Mbps, 25mbps would seam fast. But that sad fact is while we will be experiencing these new speeds the rest of the world has even now already moved of to bigger and better things.
Exactly 4x faster than our crappy average isn’t ‘good’ its just 4x crappy. Factor in as well its made no changes to the stability of the offerings either (which is also a rather large point of contention).
Heck I think if we go with unreality we may as well still have black and white TV’s!
All the rest of the world has NOT moved onto better things, FTTN is well entrenched in many countries and is continuing to be rolled out.
Also HFC and its planned upgrade to DOCSIS 3.1 is used by Comcast in the USA which has 56% of the USA’s broadband market.
“By moving to DOCSIS 3.1 technology, Comcast will be able to provide 1 Gbps services on its existing Hybrid Fiber Coaxial (HFC) network. Howald said the vast majority of Comcast’s customers are on that network.”
http://www.fiercecable.com/story/comcast-well-cover-our-entire-footprint-10-gpbs-capable-docsis-31-tech-soon/2015-08-21
The Coalition NBN Co plan to have 34% of residences on HFC, which is even higher than the planned FTTN figure of 29%.
LOL Reality So they haven’t moved on yet you like an article of delivering upto 1Gbps while Turnbull SOE for NBN is to only deliver at least 25Mbps.
So i ask you like i ask Richard if NBN is only required to deliver only 25Mbps why are people on HFC getting a free upgrade when people on FTTn that require better service has to pay more for connecting fibre from home to node than it is for NBN to connect FTTP from home to dslam.
Yes FTTN is entrenched most started a decade ago and are now moving to FTTP. But good luck with NBN using g.fast since it needs 200m of copper and the average length of copper between node and pillar is 350M.
Jason K
“So they haven’t moved on yet you like an article of delivering upto 1Gbps ”
I assume you mean ‘link an article’, and yes I know they haven’t moved on yet, that’s why I said ‘planned upgrade’.
“while Turnbull SOE for NBN is to only deliver at least 25Mbps. ”
I have no idea what that statement means in relation to upgrading HFC and its future upgrade to DOCSIS 3.1.
“when people on FTTn that require better service has to pay more for connecting fibre from home to node than it is for NBN to connect FTTP from home to dslam.”
You don’t connect FTTP to DSLAM’s (ADSL1/2+).
I don’t know what your point is.
“Yes FTTN is entrenched most started a decade ago and are now moving to FTTP”
Yes I know some countries are moving to FTTP only, except those countries that are still rolling out FTTN and FTTP.
“But good luck with NBN using g.fast since it needs 200m of copper”
I never mentioned G. Fast, and it’s 250m.
So Reality
“I said ‘planned upgrade’.”
isn’t moving on?
“I have no idea what that statement means in relation to upgrading HFC and its future upgrade to DOCSIS 3.1.”
People on HFC gets a free upgrade to +100mbps while people on FTTN has to pay.
“You don’t connect FTTP to DSLAM’s (ADSL1/2+).
I don’t know what your point is.”
sorry Fslam since the cost of FTTP $3700. Yet it cost more on FOD. Wasnt going MTM was to make the FTTP upgrade cheaper?
“I never mentioned G. Fast, and it’s 250m.”
I know you didnt but you mention 1Gpbs on HFC was just giving a comparison you that comment on FTTN.
Is feigning ignorance STILL the only tactic you’ve got, Flude?
Congratulations on having very low standards, but you shouldn’t expect the rest of Australia to adhere to that.
Not everyone will even get 25Mbps. NBN are already designing to transmission loss standards that won’t reach 25Mpbs for some people just to save on costs.
What were you saying only this morning HC, about those on dial up thinking ADSL was the ultimate?
Those who having obtained “superfast ADSL1” said they’d also be happy for evermore with such blistering speeds.
Well it seems they weren’t happy afterall and have returned and now demand (surprise surprise) what ever FttN can give them and that will then do them forever more. Whilst of course as Jason K points out, ridiculously linking to articles mentioning 1Gbps speeds… lol
Some people eh?
You forgot to mention the 10’s of thousands compared to the original promise of the entire country by 2016 :P
“Under the Coalition Government’s broadband policy, NBN has shaved years off construction time while still delivering superfast broadband to more than nine million premises nationwide over the next three years. The Central Coast and Hunter regions are the first to gain access to the FTTN-based network.””
20k premises over 4 weeks so 5K a week.
FTTP was doing over 10K a week.
Great to see the FTTN rollout deploying do much faster than FTTP.
But to get that target they need to do 57.5k premises a week to hit his 9mil in 3 years looks like there on target.
In other news, Salesman describes product as “Worth Buying”!
I wouldnt! personally I rate the following speeds as:
25/5 Mbps = sub-standard Broadband
50/20 Mbps = Broadband
100/40 Mbps = Fast Broadband
250/100 Mbps = Very Fast Broadband
500/200 Mbps = Super Fast Broadband
1000/400 Mbps = Ultra Fast Broadband
and so on.
This is an excerpt from a forum topic I plan to post in the near future:
This is what I wish people would focus on more, uploads mean far more than downloads when realising the benefits of superfast internet.
Yes I’m sick of taking hours to upload a video, if it was the same speed my downloads are it would be mere minutes.
Tangent: Is Fifield’s head photoshopped on in that photo?
No, that’s his real head and what he actually looks like.
Now c’mon. He doesn’t have a neck. Show a bit of decorum and stop drawing attention to it. ;)
Headloose perhaps Kenny ;)
He’s definitely built like a rugby player, hopefully he’s smarter than one as most seem to have trouble stringing two sentences together!
I was just waiting for one of these comments about his head :P
Is it just me or does Fifield look like the old man in the movie ‘Up’?
Superfast, asymmetrical speed. We need upload speeds. Stop spruiking just download speeds.
Why don’t you guys wake up?
It doesn’t matter a rats arse how high your down load and up load speeds are. If the person with whom you want to communicate on the net can only do a max of 100kbs up an down then guess what your internet speed is going to be interacting with that person?
The need for speed varies and is entirely dependent on the person using the internet and what they want and how much they want to share. Or to put it another way, the needs of a woman with 6 kids and a husband will be entirely different to a single dude. The need of a business with two staff will be different to one with one hundred staff in the same type of business. The thing of course is that you need to have the capacity to service all the high needs user if you are going to succeed.
FTTN puts us in the position of not being able to communicate equally with people regardless of where they are. The stupid situation will exist where it is going to be faster to communicate with a person twenty kilometers away than a person five houses way. What a mess!! What a failure!!
Yes, my house looks like crap except for that big, fat, shiny new FTTN cabinet on my footpath.
Thanks Prime Minister! $#@$%&!!!
Unlike above ground FTTP Fibre Distribution Hub cabinets which you can hardly notice. :)
https://delimiter.com.au/2011/04/21/brunswick-nbn-rollout-photos/
Apparently the FTTN cabinets used in Australia are the smallest design Alcatel sells world wide.
So we’ll put you down for one of those “small” monoliths outside your place then?
Still no reply to the one Nat Senator either?
That’s a bit unkind, I wouldn’t call a FDH cabinet a small monolith, the graffiti adds a nice urban touch don’t you think , you hardly notice it’s there.
I’m sure one of those “small” Westinghouse sized cabinets with those blazing speeds of UPTO 25mbps (as you ordered since you found – oh fuck ADSL isn’t good enough after all) right out the front of your place, would be perfect.
Even more perfect of course, would that grafitti… I.e. a nice artists impression of Tony in his budgie smugglers (or even better sans the formalities) which I’m positive would be just that special touch for you ;)
HC… I think you hit the nail on the head over at the other blog, regarding this one… LOL
Hah, I was going to post that I feel sorry for the person who owns the house with the now big green cabinet sitting out the front…. although on the bright side you should hopefully get decent internet.
Nothing wrong with a bit of self promotion though, but it would be nice if the media kindly reminded voters of the libs promises that were made prior to the election. I live within a stone throw of the Perth CBD and I’m not even in the latest three year plan, areas with existing fibre/HFC or newer areas are pretty much all that’s in the list.
I’m not sure if that’s a good or bad thing, hoping that the libs are voted out and the plans changed but all that will likely result in is more delays.
The house and cabinet are of the same era.
To take that nice insightful observation one step further MikeK.
The house, the cabinet and… in fact the minister (3 x incidental political puns unintended :) are all of the same era…
How come the average download from FTTN in New Zealand was only 13Mb, what is so different about ours and there’s.
One doesn’t let little niceties like reality to interfere with our three word slogans and FUD. Of course ours is going to be superfast up to 100Mb/s (soft guarantee of up to 25Mb/s), the press statement written by a political flunky said so…
I wonder how the owner of the property feels with that cabinet on their front lawn, surely it would devalue the house? although being right next to the node he/she could advertise “super fast broadband!”.
I don’t know Andrew the pillar could be 350m from the node so that could be 700 of copper right there may get upto 50Mbps at best if that’s the case.
NBN bought 1800ks of copper so the pillar could be anywhere in Australia.
+1…LOL
I think the real question here is what the hell is an elected representative doing promoting Telstra’s business interests?
Oh that’s right, it’s part of the corrupt deal they made to destroy the NBN.
The Coalition NBN Policy that they won the election on is being implemented, the contracts for the FTTN build have been signed and that rollout has stated in earnest (finally!) and will continue on until the 2016 election and for a period past that even if the Coalition are booted out (not likely at this stage it seems).
Supporters of the original Labor NBN model described as being ‘too ambitious’ and with a ‘failed construction model’ by the ex Minister in charge of it, really need to move on.
If ranting about fraudband over and over and discussions about the photo of Mitch Fifields head and ‘cabinets on lawns’ is as good as the criticism gets the Coalition have nothing whatever to worry about with the community at large accepting their policy.
Lol… those who always have, and continue to, look backwards to antiquated copper, accuse those who are here in the now and wish to be part of the future, of needing to move on…Gold?
Once again you are demonstrating the continual backward logic I mentioned you people have, just yesterday. Because, err, everyone has moved on “except you retrograde copper cheerleaders”.
For example… every time there’s an article which isn’t glowing (but how could even one be glowing ;) relating to the Coalition’s FttN and we start spelling out FACTS – such as their already admitted missed target of 2016 for all Aussies 25mbps – 50mbps, the UPTO (lol) $15B blow out in costs and the fact that the Coalition are rolling out the network they themselves opposed and referred to as fraudband, etc, etc… the same old faces (even with new names) “can’t handle the truth” and go straight to the past with, but they, but FttP, but white elephant, but gold plated Ferrari…
FFS short memory much… HC mentioned this very issue to you personally, just yesterday… the issue being the very warped and devious way you the faithful try to deflect from now to the past.
HC [quote] “Funny that this article is about FttN (the future according to coalition clowns) but you keep brining up the past (FttP) we’ll never know what could have happened because the coalition got GimpCo to make a mess of it rather than proceed with the vastly superior plan. The only thing we can do is speculate. However since the fraudband patchwork plan is the one currently being executed we can make few predictions (just as the coalition clowns did about FttP). Since they’ve lied to us so far we have to take that into account so 2021 sounds more reasonable.”
:/ unbelievable
Reality
“Rollout has stated in earnest”
Consider it was still on Turnbull website that they would be do a massive rollout starting the mid 2014 which now doesn’t start until 2017.
But then how is that policy of $29B to deliver 25Mbps to all by end of 2016.
Fraudband
Let me give you a history lesson a certian coalition member coined the word fraudband in 2007 when Rudd was doing the tender for FTTN. We are just calling it fraudband becuase we agree with this gov that has coined it as such but they are still rolling it out.
http://www.fionanash.com.au/Media/MediaReleases/tabid/84/articleType/ArticleView/articleId/213/LABORS-RURAL-FRAUDBAND.aspx
Fiona Nash wasn’t alone, as I already mentioned to “Reality” when he suggested there was only one Nat Senator who said fraudband…
Reality didn’t respond…lol
I know Nash is just the easiest to find.
But it’s the only thing us fanboys agree with this gov on lol.
So what’s it matter who used the term fraudband and how many MP’s did use it and how many years ago it was, it is 2015 different Communications Minister implementing a 2013 election winning Communications policy based on a mix of infrastructure.
As I said in another post, dial-up and 1500/256 ADSL1 were called fraudband, all ADSL1 was called fraudband, there was even one discussion headed ‘satellite fraudband’ blah blah blah on and on it goes year in year out.
Shout fraudband all you like, it’s not going to make any difference to the FTTN rollout, you think this Government is going to say oh look some posters in Delimiter and Whirlpool are calling FTTN fraudband – “STOP THE FTTN ROLLOUT” while we take a year out and review this bizarre fraudband phenomenon.
@1950’s_Reality
It’s #FraudBand because FTTN was a valid choice in 2003 & only just in 2007 … However it’s now 2015 and it is no longer a valid choice for meeting current and future Residential or Business bandwidth requirements!
Is that clear enough for you?
Additionally, how can it be considered fraudband in 2008 and then not be considered fraudband by the same people in 2015?
Here, I have a fresh packet of straws you can clutch. They’re super thin.
Reality
What reality are you on if you think a policy is great when it’s 7 years behind it target in just 3 months or gone from $29b to $41b in 3 months but after 2 years it’s now $56B.
Turnbull policy claimed to cost third of FTTP and be sooner. Now it’s only $8B less and 1 year sooner.
@ Reality (ahem),
It matters because firstly… even though you and your crusade desperately need to shake off the embarrassing FACT that those who now roll out FttN, referred to it as fraudband and opposed it previously… no matter what completely ridiculous spin you humorously put on it… these people (plural) actually used the term fraudband.
Can you understand and do you accept this?
Secondly. Initially you “unsuccessfully tried to downplay the term by claiming only one Nat Senator said it…
But you were…. WRONG! Can you understand and do you accept this?
So wrong in fact, that the then Deputy PM (Vaile) and Comms Minister(Coonan) both called it fraudband… Can you understand this and accept this?
Thirdly, again you make claims (as you did with one Nat Senator) and as I have already asked you once, I’ll remind you again… (as Delimiter is a factually based commentary site)… if you are going to claim something “you need to prove it”.
Can you understand and do you accept this?
So please link to where these other technologies apart from FttN (better still feel free to include FttN…LOL) were actually ever referred to as “fraudband” or as usual your baseless BS will be treated as not only baseless BS but it will again show that even disgraceful intentional lying forms part of your factless commentary style.
Thank you.
*tumbleweed*, as is typical.
“The Coalition NBN Policy that they won the election on is being implemented”
1.5 years late and missing their 25Mbps to ALL deadline by 5 years. I like how the start delay isn’t even proportionate to end delay. They were elected on promises they had no ability or intention to keep.
“Supporters of the original Labor NBN model … really need to move on.”
When costing the taxpayer an extra >$60b over the next ten years, no. Concerned citizens are required to scream and shout.
There NEEDS to be a Royal Inquisition.
“If ranting about fraudband over and over”
That term you hate so much that Turnbull coined in relation to building a FttN network?
“discussions about the photo of Mitch Fifields head and ‘cabinets on lawns’ is as good as the criticism gets the Coalition have nothing whatever to worry about ”
Your head is well and truly in the clouds, Flude. Come back to Earth.
I have checked out the roll out spreadsheet and I am confused. My suburb, West Melbourne, is listed as having HFC as the carrier mode – there is no HFC cabling in the area. Are they going to install HFC cabling?
bbt,
West Melbourne might be in this category, inner suburb next to the CBD like yours it sounds feasible.
“expanding the HFC rollout into all the ‘black spots’ inside those overall rollouts that were left behind when the original rollouts ceased.”
https://delimiter.com.au/2013/12/14/simply-wrong-hackett-attacks-nbn-hfc-critics/
West Melbourne is classified as a heritage area, which is why we never got HFC first up. We all have to get Foxtel Satellite. I wish some journalist would call them on it.
Probably a local council thing at the time with the overhead HFC cable, which makes it interesting how they are going to do it to West Melbourne this time around, I think the Optus HFC build was all overhead, Telstra HFC was a mix of both but mainly underground because they already had the ducting.
Of course if the NBN Co do fill out HFC black spots Optus and Telstra won’t be chasing each other with duplicate HFC rollouts down the same streets. :)
I was not aware of Telstra doing underground HFC. I thought it was all overhead. However, if they are going to do HFC via the ducts, why not do the fibre?
Wow Reality …
You make claims as if gospel and when questioned personally refuse to answer.
But when another asks a generic question “you” must answer?
More backward logic…
Whatever dude.
It’s not backward, it’s one-way.
Presumably straight into an asylum.
HOLY SHIT that thing is huge!!!
And that Node he’s leaning on is a damn eye sore, too.
I like the high visibility NBN vests – to stand on a street. Dangerous ground. Admittedly it might be dangerous showing your face anywhere in Australia as Communications Minister in a LNP Government that is pouring our money down the drain while talking about raising GST and revenue shortfalls.
Reading the comment section is like reading Whirlpool circa 2009…
The posters change but the constant to and fro remains the same… X D
That’s because people who promote FttN can’t tell the difference between 1950, 2009, 2015 and beyond.
But we are trying our best to prise open their “eye” ;)
Comments are closed.