“Hopeless, useless and a joke”: Labor MP sets Turnbull NBN policy on fire

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news Federal Parliament erupted into a fiery debate yesterday over Malcolm Turnbull’s reshaping of the NBN project, with Labor MP Lisa Chesters stealing much of the show with a furious diatribe in which she labelled the PM’s NBN plan as “incompetent, hopeless, useless and a joke”.

The original version of the NBN as envisioned by the previous Labor Government called for most Australian premises to be covered by a full Fibre to the Premises rollout, with the remainder to be covered by satellite and fixed wireless technology.

The Coalition’s controversial Multi-Technology Mix instituted by Malcolm Turnbull as Communications Minister has seen the company switch to a technically inferior model re-using and upgrading the legacy copper (Fibre to the Node) and HFC cable networks owned by Telstra and Optus.

Earlier this week, during Senate Estimates hearings, Labor revealed it had received about 60 complaints from early adopters of the Government’s preferred Fibre to the Node NBN rollout model, many of whom were receiving such poor service that they would prefer to have their original ADSL broadband back.

Following the hearings, a debate was held in Federal Parliament yesterday afternoon on the topic of Turnbull’s version of the NBN. You can read the full debate here in PDF format (it starts on page 71).

Although various Labor figures spoke in the debate, including Shadow Communications Minister Jason Clare and Canberra’s Gai Brodtmann, a long-term advocate for better broadband in the ACT, it was the Member for Bendigo, Lisa Chesters, who proved one of the more passionate debaters of the afternoon.

Chesters (see the MP’s full speech in video above), blasted the Turnbull Government for its NBN policy, saying constituents in her area in central and regional Victoria commonly described the policy as “incompetent, hopeless, useless and a joke”. The Labor MP went on to highlight a number of specific issues she believed the Coalition policy suffered from.

Firstly, Chesters pointed out that several NBN Fixed Wireless towers had been built in 2013 in her electorate under the previous Labor Government, but had not actually been turned on.

“Under this Government, two and a bit years on, they have not been switched on,” Chesters said. “How incompetent are you as a government not to even switch these towers on? Businesses look out their window to a tower that has not been switched on. Homes look out their window to a tower that has not been switched on.”

In her area, because of the lack of clarity about the future of Australian broadband, Chesters said people were confused as to how they were supposed to access the Internet.

“There is one street in Woodend where they have been offered four different types of internet services. Some homes are on ADSL2; some homes are on ADSL1; some homes have been told, ‘Just use your internet on your mobile phone’; and some homes have been told, ‘You’ll have to get satellite services.’ That is one street in one town in my electorate,” she said. “What a mess — five different options, including none at all, which is option No. 5,” she said.

Chesters said because of the NBN company’s failure to provide broadband to Victorians in her area, many were relying on their mobile phones for broadband instead. That practice, in turn, was clogging up the mobile phone network, she said.

The Bendigo MP said she had written to Turnbull in his former role as Communications Minister, as well as the current Minister, Senator Mitch Fifield, asking each to come to central Victoria and examine the issue.

“The former minister cancelled the meeting … yet during the election he came to Bendigo and promised the people of Bendigo that they would get fast-speed broadband sooner and cheaper,” said Chesters.

“What a con! It is an absolute con and it is a lie. He promised they would get it in 2016, and here we are in 2016 and the people of Bendigo and central Victoria still do not have it.”

Chesters pointed out that the Fibre to the Node model which the Government prefers was relying on Telstra’s existing copper network. “How incompetent are you to buy back old, ageing technology?” she said.

“Telstra think it is great. They have sold a dud asset back to a government. There is nothing but incompetence when it comes to the NBN. People in central Victoria know it, as does regional Victoria. Coalition MPs can bury their heads in the sand and pretend it is not an issue, but it is, and every single day there are people in their electorates, like in my electorate, complaining. ”

Coalition response
In response, Coalition MPs pilloried Labor’s record on the NBN.

Member for Robertson Lucy Wicks — a former Telstra PR staffer — highlighted what she said was a poor history of delivery from Labor on the NBN (see the video below).

“Labor claimed that a massive 90 per cent of premises in and around Gosford were so-called open for business with the NBN when in actual fact 90 per cent of them were classified service class 0 or service class 1, meaning that, despite the fanfare and the press release, a lot of work was required before those people who wanted a service could actually connect,” said Wicks.

“What is even worse, despite all of this fanfare during the election and during their time in government, when we came into government there were little more than 200 premises connected in my electorate.”

“What a farce—to tell businesses and families that Gosford was ‘open for business’, only to discover that, despite Labor’s press releases, they could not actually access it at their premise.”

Wicks said Labor was so obsessed with delivering “Fibre to the press release” in areas like Gosford that they forgot to actually focus on delivering broadband to people. “Labor sold people in my electorate a dud deal,” she said.

In contrast, Wicks said the Coalition Government had focused on rolling out the NBN to more homes and businesses sooner, cheaper and more reliably than Labor.

“This government has a responsible strategy to roll out a more affordable Multi-Technology Mix,” said Wicks. “The case for the Multi-Technology approach is clear. It is far better for productivity on the Central Coast, for instance, to get fast broadband to premises quickly, than to deliver extremely fast broadband to just an exclusive few years and years down the track. It is like waiting for Godot!”

Wicks said it was possible to see the benefit of the MTM approach to the NBN in the fact that the NBN company’s Net Promoter Score ratings system had recently shown the same levels of customer satisfaction from customers on Fibre to the Node services as those on the original Fibre to the Premises model.

“The half-yearly results are a ringing endorsement of our approach,” said Wicks. “In fact, the NBN rollout is accelerating, with 1.7 million homes and businesses now able to order a connection. We are finally back on track with the NBN rollout, with plans to expand the footprint by 15,000 premises per week, rising to 25,000 per week by the middle of the year.”

Video credit: Parliamentary Broadcasting

99 COMMENTS

  1. We are finally back on track with the NBN rollout, with plans to expand the footprint by 15,000 premises per week, rising to 25,000 per week by the middle of the year.”

    Hmmm…now where have I heard that before….oh, yeah, previous NBN releases!

    • I assume they were just waiting to for enough rope..

      … and w/ the complications of rolling out 3 different technologies (soon to be 4) the rope their getting will just steadily increase.

        • There msm aren’t paying any attention to all this. The majority of public aren’t being informed.

          • As is the case when MSM likes the current government of the day..

            I’m just waiting got MT to take that one policy that’s too lefty for his hard right mates to flip the switch for the MSM to “love” Labor again. =P

  2. I love how Coalition keep harping on about “reliably” on the roll out when there’s a dime a dozen of various anecdotal complaints on either delays or issues w/ activation on connections on FTTP once they “sped up” those roll outs…

    .. and now their being compounded w/ issues on FTTN *and* wireless now. Will be most amusing when HFC gets “switched on” and installers/premises have to contend w/ 4 utterly different technologies.

    • You are confused, the HFC is already ‘switched on’, it’s the Labor NBN Co that wanted it ‘switched off’, it needed the lucrative HFC areas customers forced onto their expensive FTTP to help justify its existence.

      MtM exactly like the Australian model is used all over the world, there is nothing unique about supporting it at a installer level here.

      • Not really. It’s being restructured into a wholesale product, something it was never designed for. Then they want to crank up customers (many whom are presently on ADSL) to high levels where it most likely won’t perform well.

        • No big deal about it being structured into a wholesale product, that’s just a matter of setting the price and RSP’s can resell it.

          Not a big deal having more customers either, it is being upgraded, eventually to DOCSIS 3.1, HFC BB is used the world over quite successfully.

  3. Just to be fair… (in relation to the MP’s comments about the towers built by Labor)

    Labor built four towers in 2013 before being sure that the carriage tower (that the four relied on) could legally be built (the MP says it was blocked by VCAT). This seems to be a problem created by the Labor government.

    I agree that another plan should have been made in the mean time, but to me it seems that the important carriage tower should have been built before the four delivery towers were. Presumably the location of the carriage tower would impact on the four delivery towers.

    • Nimbies at Mt Camel. Started out as “Fades the curtains, vibe of the thing” then finished in VCAT as a vague Aboriginal thing. Funny though, the local aboriginals declined to get involved. Mt Camel is a pimple rather than a mountain, ffs. No blame on NBN at the time. They had similar probs at Mt Helen and Cardigan towers in Ballarat. Tin foil morons.

      • But why Lucy Witless? Imposed on the Central Coast by Abbott as part of the fanatical centre right faction, this political waste of space has been an embarrassment desperately floundering in local circles trying to explain the disaster that the MTM has created on the Central Coast, let alone parroting the drivel in this article. Still, she’s just stupid, at least that’s better than Mal and the little fat guy, they are treacherous pros…

        • Because there is absolutely no way that I am inflicting Paul Fletcher on you guys any more, and Lucy is an up and coming youngish Liberal with some growing cred.

          I want to show some more faces on Delimiter, it has been a bit same old, same old.

          • And Paul Fletcher burnt his hard earned credibility to the ground by joining the liberals and throwing out everything he said he believed in!

            I consider him to be as big a traitor to Australian ICT as Turnbull because he knew better and despite this has supported every retrograde move his party has made in the last 6 years.

        • gab4moi,

          Nice one, when the message is embarrassing and awkward to counter deploy the fall back tactic, shoot the messenger.

          • “Hopeless, useless and a joke” MTM, isn’t awkward at all (for those with sense)… it’s known as the truth.

            You ought to try using the truth in a comment, even only once, it won’t hurt, I promise.

            You’re welcome

  4. He stuffed up Australia’s Largest Infrastructure Project Royally , & now he is running Australia ? WTF ? Turdball get out before you stuff evrything up ….. Useless

  5. No expensive royal commission. The collusion to defend Murdoch is obvious. Just jail the lot of them.

  6. Attack:
    MTM general issues
    MTM specific issies
    NBN failure to implement LP’s own policy of ‘sooner’, where existing infrastructure was not activated.

    Defence:
    But Labor!
    nbn pr announcement, now out of date. (or was that a LP announcement previosly made by nbn?)

    Perhaps Wicks should have stuck with honesty.
    ‘We are stuck trying to make do with this horrendous policy. Malcolm could not sell a fibre based policy to the Abbot liberal party and expect to keep his position, so he had to come up with this abortive kluge of out of date tech. Sadly he sold this diatribe too well and we are now stuck with it. This multi billion dollar waste of money is well spent in getting Malcom to the PM seat.”

  7. there needs to be more MPs like this we all should be ourtaged it what they have done to a good project

  8. Interesting the Labor MP for Bendigo moaning about BB in Woodend didn’t take the opportunity to outline what Labor would do for Woodend if elected, or in fact why Woodend did not get FTTP during six years of Labor reign, or why the wireless towers were not switched on.

    Missed opportunity, I’m sure Woodend residents would love to know who will get them a viable NBN solution first.

    • Well reality well it’s not going to be this year is it. Just trying to remember who made that claim lol

      • What’s ‘not going to be this year’ for Woodend, also I missed what a Labor NBN Co is going to do for Woodend if elected, any ideas?

        • reality I think it was that policy you linked that failed in less than 3 months record time lol. I think it’s the same policy you link claimed it used the HFC when that same policy showed 0% used lol

        • @ alain

          More FRAUDBAND

          But regardless … gotta love the perpetual mindless MTM yes men eh?

          It used to be, but they, but FTTP, but back then.

          Now they have intelligently (ahem) morphed to…

          But what? But when?

          Oh my sides are splitting with laughter…

        • So the desperate DETOUR THIS WAY sign has been put up by two FTTP cheer leaders, in other words we have no idea what the alternative Labor NBN policy to be released ‘real soon now’ will do for Woodend, nor it seems does the Labor member for Bendigo.

          There are no answers by the Labor MP why Woodend missed out on Labor’s first go at a NBN after six years, but apparently it’s all the current MtM models fault.

          lol

          • Read the article again starting with the headline – here let me spoon feed you yet again child…

            “Hopeless, useless and a joke” in reference to MTM… got it now?

            So who is the actual one detouring from the topic and talking complete rubbish?

            That’d be you, again, or rather still/as usual.

            You’re welcome.

          • Did or did not Turnbull say we all would have 25Mbps by the end of this year.

            But as always devoid or reality try’s and detour the argument from the failing in the policy.

          • Devoid of reality doesn’t want to answer the question surprise surprise lol keep the deflection up just show how desperate the Turnbull fan club it

    • “didn’t take the opportunity to outline what Labor would do for Woodend if elected”
      They were scheduled for FTTP Feb 2014. Obviously the Coalition decided Woodend can suck it.

      • A shitload of areas were scheduled for FTTP, it didn’t mean they were going to get it.
        When you halve your targets from original estimates at the end in 2013 a lot of areas have to miss out, many areas they were scheduled to get FTTN since 2010 were simply deleted from the Labor NBN Co whiteboard.

        MP Lisa Chesters still didn’t explain what a Labor NBN Co would do for Woodend while having a Coalition MtM bash, you left that awkward bit out.

        Oh and in case you missed what has been happening since 2013, the Coalition NBN policy is not the same as the failed Labor NBN policy.

        • Devoid of reality was labor doing FTTN now lol.

          But MTM is faster is it as those areas would have had FTTP by now and they still don’t even have the MTM lol. But thanks for pointing out the folly of the coalition halve there targets or there cost blowout and time ballooned out by another 5 years lol

        • “A shitload of areas were scheduled for FTTP, it didn’t mean they were going to get it.”
          Just like every other FTTP scheduled area with a set date that the Liberals didn’t cancel – er, oh wait. I’m on FTTP, so I guess areas scheduled for FTTP DID get FTTP until the Liberals cancelled contracts.

          What was your point again?

          “When you halve your targets from original estimates at the end in 2013”
          And for an ELEVENTH time, I will ask – and yet again go unanswered – so you’re saying in 2013 Labor only promised 46.5% of Aus premises will get FTTP?

          “many areas they were scheduled to get FTTN since 2010”
          That’s an impressive claim, considering Labor never had a FTTN rollout planned.

          “MP Lisa Chesters still didn’t explain what a Labor NBN Co would do for Woodend while having a Coalition MtM bash, you left that awkward bit out.”
          Woodend was scheduled to have FTTP on Feb 2014. That got cancelled by the Liberal party. What else is there to say?

          “Oh and in case you missed what has been happening since 2013, the Coalition NBN policy is not the same as the failed Labor NBN policy.”
          And yet you expect Labor MPs to speak for the Coalition. Impressive yet again.

          • I was supposed to get FTTP Sept 2014… Bzzzt

            alain feel free to prove I wouldn’t have… waiting…. still waiting… ?

            Proving FTTN is NOT quicker…

            I’m now awaiting FTTN (*slow clap*)… I will keep you all posted, as the clock is ticking.

            :)

  9. Chesters pointed out that the Fibre to the Node model which the Government prefers was relying on Telstra’s existing copper network. “How incompetent are you to buy back old, ageing technology?” she said.

    How incompetent is to pay the same amount of money for Telstra to shut down the copper and the HFC so Labor could overbuild it with the highest fixed line infrastructure Cost per Premise – FTTP?

    • Actually quite responsible.
      The ongoing costs of fault finding and maintainence of the copper network are huge in comparison with an overbuild of fibre.
      The fibre planning and implementation included end to end fault finding built in. – Designed for lower opex.
      Then there is the huge MACD opex cost of FTTN
      Add to that the cost of power, a cost that is growing significantly faster than CPI.

      If you compare the networks honestly, the FTTP network is financially better after ~7 yrs. It is also already able to reach speeds that FTTN would require billions more to be able to achieve.

      Liberal policy was dependant on increasing the speed of the rollout. Then thy cancelled FTTP deployments that were already planned and even had contracts. Not activating these towers. Huge delays in MTM, as well as ‘unplanned’ costs in Malcolm’s ‘fully planned and costed’ MTM. Even now, NBN would have been in a better financial position if they had just continued with the FTTP deployments.

      And no, FTTP is not the highest fixed line infrastructure cost proposal. Total cost of ownership shows that FTTN is far more expensive. We have not seen the costs of the HFC builds and upgrades yet, bet remember that even Telsra did not think rolling this out further was viable.

      • +1 MAgus

        Plus Reality is being dishonest when he says it was just “to shut down the copper and the HFC”. It was also to get access to the “pits and pipe” mate, but then you knoew that already, right?

      • MAgus,

        Even now, NBN would have been in a better financial position if they had just continued with the FTTP deployments.

        Really, any facts to back up this speculation?

        And no, FTTP is not the highest fixed line infrastructure cost proposal.

        Yes it is, the comparative CPP costs are in the latest CP16, it is only slightly lower than fixed wireless, it also the highest cost fixed line infrastructure overseas as well.

        Total cost of ownership shows that FTTN is far more expensive.

        Show us how you have modeled that calculation.

        We have not seen the costs of the HFC builds and upgrades yet

        Yes we have it’s in CP16, go and have a look.

        , bet remember that even Telsra did not think rolling this out further was viable.

        So the NBN Co shouldn’t use what HFC is already available from Optus and Telstra and obtained for the same $$ Labor were going to pay for NOT getting it because Telstra and Optus stopped rolling it out many years ago?

        • It’s in the CP16, it’s in the CP16… BFD?

          So are 4 year blow outs and UPTO (lol) $27B more than we were promised for this fully costed MTM charade, the Coalition themselves dubbed FRAUDBAND.

          How about some real figures? Try Quigley’s.

          No they shouldn’t, reuse HFC networks… they are FAILED networks aren’t they?

          Well that’s what you argued and argued over and claimed previously. Didn’t you… remember you telling us that?

          Going on grow some and admit it…

          But I love the complete avoidance of this, the typical MIA and the desperate tap dancing in repeating how great HFC is now, when you said it FAILED in the past…

          PRICELESS subservience and/or stupidity. But then you did admit to be dishonest, so… kudos there.

    • Lies damn lies and politics.
      The current complicated mess is paying more and taking on the risk that belonged to Telstra.
      The previous NBN payed for access to pits and pipes and the migration of the Telstra customer base in a timely manner(all Telstra customers including wholesale) by the shutdown of alternative fix lines services. Telstra where responsible for ensuring the pits and pipes where up to the task. That hole asbestos issue Telstra’s issue their risk and their expensive.

      Now they have payed the same initial cost for the copper but they have also taken on the expense and the risks of the network. So Telstra collect the same cash with out any of the associated risks and on top of they get to be paid again to fix bits of the network that was previously their responsibility and expense.

      But hey if you forget about all the additional costs and risks that NBN took on yes it did cost the same. Just like if you forget about all the risks and additional costs associated with FTTN it looks pretty cheap, that’s what they did when MT decided to go down this rabbit hole. It is also the reason for the cost blow outs now making it cost also as much as the ‘highest fixed infrastructure cost per premise’ without the same revenue potential.

    • Incompetent in the extreme to take ownership of costs for the same money.
      11billion for customers
      Vs
      11 billion for customers and 3billion dollars cost per year maintenance and pit/duct works.

      I know which deal I’d take (to spell it out, the one that doesn’t include any number of billions of dollars in maintenance fees)

    • “How incompetent is to pay the same amount of money for Telstra to shut down the copper and the HFC so Labor could overbuild it with the highest fixed line infrastructure Cost per Premise – FTTP?”

      Considerably less so, given the high ROI, and the cost of copper remediation for the next ten (likely twenty) years.

      • Figures have gone missing in action again Hotcakes, dice throwing will do in the interim.

        • This is where common sense normally kicks in with rational people who aren’t on an obsequious crusade. Or where when previously spelled out over and over, the person asking the question (if legitimate) says, oh yes of course…thank you.

          But then we are dealing with a special brand of snide plus smart arse with lashings of stupid… in relation the copper knuckle draggers.

        • Still no figures, just embarrassing (for your cause) ranting, you still don’t get it.

          • Still no answer or recognition of you saying HFC was a “FAILED NETWORK”, just embarrassing (for your cause) ranting, you still don’t get it.

            In fact you never did and never will get it, because your motives aren’t honourable and you will freely contradict, spin and out and out lie for the crusade.

            You see, I want FTTP for Australia regardless of who will deliver it, as the information shows it the best option IMO. Whereas you pitifully will not only accept but will promote what ever the Coalition says, even this disgraceful MTM, they themselves (and I’d bet you) described as fraudband FTTN and failed HFC.

          • Still no figures, just embarrassing (for your cause) ranting, you still don’t get it.

            He could tell you, but they are commercial in confidence :o)

  10. “How incompetent is to pay the same amount of money for Telstra to shut down the copper and the HFC”

    That money was necessary pay Telstra for it’s customer base, to ease the separation and to bribe Telstra not to block the rollout in the High Court. It was a direct result of the incompetent privatisation of Telstra by, you guessed it, the LNP. Getting Telstra out of the way of broadband innovation in this country was worth a lot more than that.

    “so Labor could overbuild it with the highest fixed line infrastructure Cost per Premise – FTTP?”

    Highest maybe, but the difference is shrinking every day. Anyway that’s only the rollout, there is another component called maintenance, which is an ongoing operational expense. It looks likely to be a billion dollars a year less with FTTP than with FTTN/HFC. How long until the MTM becomes the more expensive option? Ten or twelve years, less?

    In the meantime what will be the loss to the economy of a substandard broadband infrastructure? At a guess, billions per year.

    • Graham,

      That money was necessary pay Telstra for it’s customer base, to ease the separation

      You do understand it was a Labor/Conroy $11B NBN deal with Telstra, and even though Conroy bragged about structurally separating Telstra it never happened, so if the intent was to ‘ease the separation’ it was money wasted eh?

      and to bribe Telstra not to block the rollout in the High Court.

      umm really? first time I have heard that one.

      It was a direct result of the incompetent privatisation of Telstra by, you guessed it, the LNP.,

      But at no point stopped by Labor during the T1, T2 and T3 phases of full privatisation.

      Getting Telstra out of the way of broadband innovation in this country was worth a lot more than that.

      The irony in that statement is that Telstra had been rolling out FTTP well before the NBN was even thought of and has the largest 4G now moving to 4GX footprints in Australia and comparable to many countries in the world re coverage , that’s not what you meant by ‘broadband innovation’ I take it?

      Highest maybe,

      Not maybe, it is.

      but the difference is shrinking every day.

      Shrinkage is a increase in brownfields FTTP CPP from the NBN Co last reporting period?

      I bet you hope FTTN and HFC CPP doesn’t shrink.

      It looks likely to be a billion dollars a year less with FTTP than with FTTN/HFC.

      Really, HFC as well, where did get that info from, is that a billion dollars each or a billion dollars shared or ….?

      How long until the MTM becomes the more expensive option? Ten or twelve years, less?

      We can speculate all day on that one and you and other FTTP fans just hope in 10 or 12 years MtM is still not the least expensive option.

      In the meantime what will be the loss to the economy of a substandard broadband infrastructure? At a guess, billions per year.

      Well anyone can guess , my guess is it won’t.

      • “even though Conroy bragged about structurally separating Telstra it never happened, so if the intent was to ‘ease the separation’ it was money wasted eh?”

        It certainly was once the LNP got elected. Why have they put separation on the backburner? Is it another gift to Telstra for services rendered?

        “But at no point stopped by Labor during the T1, T2 and T3 phases of full privatisation.”

        In what universe was this possible? I take it you have never heard of Mal Colston?

        “The irony in that statement is that Telstra had been rolling out FTTP well before the NBN”

        I hope you aren’t comparing grossly overpriced CBD corporate fibre connections with a national network. That would just be pathetic.

        “has the largest 4G now moving to 4GX footprints in Australia and comparable to many countries in the world re coverage , that’s not what you meant by ‘broadband innovation’ I take it?”

        Since we are talking about the fixed line NBN, then no, it’s not. Aside from the fact that Testra’s 4G product is woefully overpriced.

        “I bet you hope FTTN and HFC CPP doesn’t shrink.”

        Considering the amount of infill and new copper that’s going to be required, I don’t see much chance of that.

        “Really, HFC as well, where did get that info from”

        It’s a guess, because since Turnbull’s Crew couldn’t be bothered to do due diligence and find out what kind of pig’s breakfast they bought from Telstra, there is no way to actually know how much maintenance is going to cost. If you have a better estimate then share it. Is maintenance for FTTP cheaper than for FTTN or not?

        “We can speculate all day on that one and you and other FTTP fans just hope in 10 or 12 years MtM is still not the least expensive option.”

        Yet since FTTP lasts so much longer and requires so little maintenance, it is inevitable that it will become the cheaper option. You and Turnbull just hope that FTTN lasts long enough to get the LNP re-elected.

        “Well anyone can guess , my guess is it won’t.”

        Unfortunately Australia loses out big time while we wait to find out how wrong you and the LNP are.

      • “Not maybe, it is.”
        Let’s see… cost of FTTN CPP + FTTP CPP versus just FTTP CPP…

        you’re not doing too well, honestly.

        “We can speculate all day on that one and you and other FTTP fans just hope in 10 or 12 years MtM is still not the least expensive option.”
        Let’s see… <$50b for FTTP vs $56b for FTTN… all in all, you just said a very strange thing.

      • Graham,

        It certainly was once the LNP got elected. Why have they put separation on the backburner? Is it another gift to Telstra for services rendered?

        I don’t think the separation of Telstra is high on the Coalitions list but it certainly was for Labor, Conroy bragged about it to the media and they had six years to do it in.
        It didn’t even get as far as legislation being drawn up and presented to Parliament.

        Big stick Conroy, with a wet straw.

        Also the operational separation of Telstra happened under the Coalition in 2006 not Labor, now according to you it’s all a ‘Coalition conspiracy’ that they are not pushing Telstra structural separation.

        It helps to put the blinkers on and ignore the history of what actually happened eh?

        In what universe was this possible? I take it you have never heard of Mal Colston?

        Yes and…?

        I hope you aren’t comparing grossly overpriced CBD corporate fibre connections with a national network. That would just be pathetic.

        No, the term FTTP is not corporate fibre loops in CBD areas, you do know Telstra and others were rolling out FTTP in greenfield estates long before a Labor NBN Co thought of it?

        Since we are talking about the fixed line NBN, then no, it’s not. Aside from the fact that Testra’s 4G product is woefully overpriced.

        You referred to getting Telstra out of the way of’ BB innovation’ here, many thousands customers use Telstra 4G solely for BB and on their free data day tomorrow I’m sure it will get hammered, you ignored the fact that Telstra innovated with FTTP before the NBN.

        I am intrigued why you think getting Telstra out of the way will do for BB in Australia, what BB innovation is being stopped Telstra?

        Considering the amount of infill and new copper that’s going to be required, I don’t see much chance of that.

        You let the FTTP CPP increase go through to the keeper I see, so assuming your guesstimate is true both FTTN and HFC have long way to go to reach $4,400 CPP on brownfields FTTP.

        BTW what is infill?

        It’s a guess,

        oh another guess, ok you have convinced me. :)

        Yet since FTTP lasts so much longer and requires so little maintenance, it is inevitable that it will become the cheaper option.

        So if and when FTTN requires a upgrade to FTTP it is inevitable it too will become the cheaper option?

        You and Turnbull just hope that FTTN lasts long enough to get the LNP re-elected.

        Don’t worry about Turnbull and the MtM, you need to hope the Labor ‘let’s have another go’ NBN policy is actually produced and is believable enough to get them elected.

        In the meantime we can monitor overseas countries like the USA and the UK who have MtM mix to see how they are losing out ‘big time’ because they are not 93% FTTP.

        • When the previous government wanted to separate Telstra the Coalition opposed it unequivocally…

          Shows you who’s side they are on…as does MTM featuring… wait for it FRAUDBAND

          As for the rest of your pointless drivel… round and round and round in circles you go. Same BS different article/thread…

          I await a typical intelligent response (ahem) along the lines of yes I thought it a bit hard or awkward, or detour sign or, whatever other copy/pasted rubbish you have to continue this circle of subservient BS…

        • “You let the FTTP CPP increase go through to the keeper I see, so assuming your guesstimate is true both FTTN and HFC have long way to go to reach $4,400 CPP on brownfields FTTP.”
          Except as acknowledged by Turnbull, Morrow, the paid-for SR and other farcical reviews, as well as every actual technology expert across the globe, FTTP is the end goal and need to be started on 5-10 years after completion of this MTMess, so the real CPP for MTM is somewhere between 5 and 7 grand.

          “So if and when FTTN requires a upgrade to FTTP it is inevitable it too will become the cheaper option?”
          Not when the total cost to install is double what it should have been, with no chance of recovering expenses in between (only a snowballing debt via remediation costs). This is elementary stuff that’s been covered extensively since 2013 – are you really this dense?

          “In the meantime we can monitor overseas countries like the USA and the UK who have MtM mix to see how they are losing out ‘big time’ because they are not 93% FTTP.”
          Yes, with all companies with FTTN ditching their FTTN rollouts in favor of FTTP; and BT, whose model we are supposedly following, declared FTTN as a waste of time/money.

  11. I went to high school with Lisa Chesters in Queensland. It’s still amazing to see her in such a role and heartening. There seems to be a growing chorus of “scrutiny” or resistance to the government’s policy. Yes, largely because it’s an election year, but it’s finally getting what it justified all along.

    • There seems to be a growing chorus of “scrutiny” or resistance to the government’s policy

      Pity Lisa Chesters is not pushing Jason Clare to release the Labor ‘have another go’ NBN policy, something with some teeth in it that will really nail this Coalition MtM policy to the wall, better move it there could be a election in August.

      • Well whatever their policy is, I’m sure the luddites now in power will find a way to fuck that up too, just as they have done going in reverse to MTM/FTTN/FRAUDBAND…

        And as I’ve said before, whatever the opposition do decide upon, I’m sure it’ll be lambasted by the government now… only for the government to later adopt it as their very own… just like they did FRAUDBAND.

        • Indeed Rizz, don’t you find it funny how with just 322 days before the 25mbps for ‘”every household and business” in Australia deadline expires the Turnbull apologists would much rather focus on past and future policies. Certainly is telling. Still unwilling to apply the same amount of scrutiny they applied to the correct NBN plan, so long as nothing is done or the roll out speed is moving at a glacial pace it’s all fine with them. Such a contrast. Remember the urgency and desperation they had for something just a bit faster than ADSL2+. Seems that has evaporated. Either they are bitterly disappointed they wont get their 25mbps by the end of 2016 and are hiding their anger really well or they are just complete hypocrites…

      • ‘have another go’ NBN policy

        Actually, the current FttN is a “have another go’ NBN policy” from the Howard years, so not sure what point you were trying to make by bring that up…

          • Yes it also uses HFC – the same HFC you said failed and was only good for pigeons to perch upon…

            Didn’t you? Don’t be shy answer… finally?

            You’re welcome.

          • The current policy is not just FTTN though is it?, that’s why it is labelled MtM.

            As was the tender Howard put out…even his panel recommended they look at using FttP though…

      • Bit hard to do anything with the NBN at this point. We don’t know how much of a mess it really is in because they won’t say anything. The lack of transparency says a lot because if the project was really going well we wouldn’t be relying on leaks for information.

      • Desperate times for the ‘back to 2013 FTTP’ cheer leaders, where all that is left as a valid counter to being continually nailed is to swear a lot and post ‘fraudband’ in CAPS over and over and over…

        Bit sad they have given up so easily.

        • Would you care to speak English, so that we can be clear just what it is you are aimlessly mumbling about this time?

          And as I asked Rob (below), I’ll ask you too, just for shits and giggles…

          Regardless (of that drivel you supplied), how does any of that justify us being lumbered with a retrograde, shitty network, the government themselves formally described as fraudband?

          • Much like our current government, they’re all style and no substance, as soon as you scratch the surface, you realise there are no fact’s to back them up. This is why the Libs use “Commercial in confidence” so much, it hides the smoke and mirrors approach they have to policy/management.

            And in the mean time, the national deficit has blown out to double where Labor had it and is increasing at about $40b this year (up from $37b last year).

          • Can you please post a link to that stat, your numbers vary from the even worse ones I’ve been quoting, but I’d like to make sure I’m quoting the correct ones.

        • “all that is left as a valid counter to being continually nailed is to swear a lot and post ‘fraudband’ in CAPS over and over and over…”
          [Citation Needed]
          And as much as I detest removal of discussion aka censorship in the form of banning people who consistently flaunt the rules, it’s this type of flagrant disregard for rational discourse that really warrants the hammer.

        • Who described FTTN as fraudband (sorry FRAUDBAND) originally alain…?

          Better not answer such a “loaded question” eh?…

          I’ll answer… the Coalition (including the then Leader of the Nats/Deputy PM as well as the Comms Minister and others). The same Coalition who now roll out FRAUDBAND dubbed FRAUDBAND, FRAUDBAND… embarrassing fact for you eh, but that is a FRAUDBAND fact…about the origins of FRAUDBAND.

          You’re welcome.

          Dispute it if you will… waiting….. still waiting

          No I thought not… you’ll now go MIA instead of posting a response (yes a lamer than usual response, phew) much like that to HC circa 2011, when he simply asked you what is your approved upload speed?

          Your response – “I am not answering your questions because you ask loaded questions…”

          HC – They are not loaded questions at all. Let’s review: So what is a alain approved upload speed?

          alain – They certainly are, you just saying they are not doesn’t mean anything.

          Classic…

          Explains why you now disappear tail between legs when there’s a logical question asked.

          You have no conviction and are simply too scared to answer …ROFL

  12. Got to love a pollie that doesn’t know much about the NBN and wants to play politics by going on a idiotic blame game rant. So lets see… the Mount Camel NBN wireless towers under the original Labor plan was rejected by VCAT on grounds of visual impact and potential Aboriginal cultural significance.
    Doesn’t that make it Labors fault for not getting the planning right? Isn’t it the incompetence of Labors NBN planning as to why her electorates NBN is now delayed? ;)
    The truth is at the end of the day there have been a number of NBN towers rejected for these sorts of reasons. People will always complain about the visual impact of communications towers no matter which company is putting them up. If her electorate want their NBN sooner then she should tell them to stop complaining and let them put the tower up.

      • True. Telstra and Optus have another site turned on before NBNco scratches itself.

      • The decision by VCAT to squash the site was in early 2015. If there were no complaints about the original (Labor) position of the tower then NBN would probably have the site up an running by now. Lisa Chesters is simply throwing out some political cannon fodder to try and drum up some noise about the NBN. It probably doesn’t matter if she’s right or wrong, the NBN is the only policy Labor have going into the next election and poor old Bill needs to get his troops to squawk about something. Looking at the polls Billy boy needs all the support he can get.

        • Yes Lisa on one side and Lucy on the other are both being political, and so are you, but they have a reason to be political, gee, after all it is their job. What’s your reason?

          Regardless, how does any of that justifiy us being lumbered with a retrograde, shitty network, the government themselves formally described as fraudband?

          • My point is if I were to write a headline for this article it would go something like this… Anti NBN Tower Residence Complain they don’t have NBN.

        • the NBN is the only policy Labor have going into the next election

          Actually, that’s pretty well arse backward Rob. They haven’t released an NBN specific policy yet, but have a lot of others. I believe they have said they will release an NBN specific one before the next election.

          http://www.alp.org.au/policy_commitments

  13. So. Whilst i feel for Gosford & Bendigo, meantime in the northern beaches of Australia’s biggest city business and homes are grinding to a standstill with ADSL services incapable of delivering enough speed to send and receive emails! And whilst suppliers and Telstra argue, nothing is being done to upgrade exchanges. At under 2kms from our local exchange we see less than 2Mbps when our contract states we ehould see 24Mbps. As an example Optus Fetch TV requires 2.99Mbps but in many areas people are simply handing this back due to Telstra techs who insist line speeds are in reality at “at least 14Mbps” but can’t explain why a computer can see only 1.01Mbps at the same time. Australia remains the lucky country only now we’re lucky to be able to send an email!

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